Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Warloch, Nov 8, 2017.
#HB225 225 CID Buick TBI Conversion Kit
Did the guy have it up and running yet?
When I started looking at things Howell was 'experimenting' with building a system. I talked to one of the techs doing the development and we had the same old Odd Fire pulse not even discussion I'd had with multiple folks. He seemed to not have thought about a simple tach signal at the time. Also, the cost he was talking about - even as a tester - was over $2500 for just the throttle body and ECU.
Looks like they have now come down into the reasonable price range that's competitive vs the other options. It was @ $1100 for the system I bought last summer to put on my nieces, and I believe about the same for my neighbors unit with the command module setup.
I guess programmatically I don't see the issue on their end. But given an issue, on our end, use a 8 cyl dist for trigger and call it a 225 CI V8 in the calibration. Unplug two wires. Fixed?
If it were TPI, sure, I can see a problem, but these systems are all TBI or eCarbs for lack of better terms.
negative ,,,,,,Howell did not specify he needed a electronic ign ,,,he was told to look for an oddfire HEI unit …… I found one for him just need to get together with him maybe this weekend
I do wonder if these can be tricked into working with a V8 dist.
Prolly have to switch to a V8 tach if you run one
Not sure what you mean there - a tach still only takes an input signal and converts it to RPM... its still relying on the 'pulse' to figure out how fast something is turning. A tach for a V8 that is using pulses from a V6 will convert things to the wrong RPM since it's looking for 8 pulses in a revolution vs the 6 that its getting. Your ECU will have the wrong RPM with that.
Use a Buick V8 dist. Tell the PCM the 225 is a 8 cyl. That will give the PCM the even fire feel it needs to not freak out. The tach output will be 8 pulses, so you’d wanna have a V8 tach.
That's not going to work - you can't use a V8 Distributor on a V6. The OF HEI V6 cap is a V8 with two blanks on the top, but the tabs inside are extended to get spark to the wires at the proper time. Spark is made when the points on the shaft (pole piece) line up to the points on the Stator ring. You convert and EF HEI by taking 3 of the points off the pole, but you still make the magnetic pulse with the 6 on the ring. That is what times the spark to the plug and it by it's very nature will only produce 6 pulses per rotation.
Remember - this still has to drive the spark to the plugs to make the engine fire, not just provide RPM to an ECU.
You’re saying you can’t use a V8 dist on an oddire V6?
That's what I said.
Interesting. Just looked it up. Yeah, the spacing isn’t the same. I’ve seen oddfire distributors but never looked close enough so see the difference. I always thought they were the same with two blanks. Never owned an oddfire. Learn something everyday.
Disregard my musings.
my buddys dauntless with tbi
How about this:Hamilton Fuel Injection. TBI-Throttle Body Injection ?
It says it is for controlling fuel and spark. The spark control is where the problem lies in that it does not work with the OF components, at least none that I've found.
Forgive me. I thought the discussion was for the F134 engine.
I'd be interested in what that Sniper BBD would do on a FHead.
So - quick update - Brandon just finished the install of HEI and the FI-Tech setup with the Command Module. It fired right up and he rated the install 4/10 on difficulty and is very pleased with it. He has 2 weeks to drive it around before heading to the mountains with it.
FYI I have a buddy who has been running Howell TBI on an oddfire for at least 10 years. It did take Howell a fair amount of trial and error to get him a chip that worked, but I have wheeled with him and it works fine.
This is going over plowed ground, trying not to high jack a 134 thread, I've looked at TBI conversions for Dauntless engines for about 12 years, and have done quite a bit of research and correspondence with the systems that say the will work with an odd fire. Initially Megasquirt was very interesting, at that time you could buy the MS kit with all the required boards and components, main board, electronics, relay board, and stimulator for about $300 an additional $100 or so for electronic soldering equipment and other bits.
I have since found that Howell will sell individual parts for their oddfire TBI kit, don't recall the exact numbers but it seemed very competitive price wise to MS. I didn't need an ecm, throttle body, throttle body adapter, sensors or fuel pump, so my costs were significantly lower. As I recall the complete Howell kit, at that time was around $1100- $1200. This included a reprogrammed ECM wiring harness, throttle body and pump. If you have some of the parts, your cost will be lower. Included is the reprogammed ECM with the initial tune by Howell and IIRC they will tune again if needed.
IMHO MegaSquirt is for people who want the last ounce of power, the most tune ability, and the pride of ownership of building and tuning their own vehicle. The learning curve is pretty steep from what I understand, the modular concept allows people to buy parts as budgets and enthusiasm (expertise) allow.
The Howell system, is flexible in the sense it allows you to buy the necessary components individually to make up a complete system. Customer support was excellent from my experience and emails were answered personally by Matt Howell. It is probably the easier system to install and get running for people with less expertise and experience with TBI. (Me)
YMMV I read MS literature until I got tangle eyed, it is both impressive and mind boggling, the more I read, the more I realized how little I knew.
The Howell system seemed much simpler due to everything but the install is done for you.
Like most things in life, you are the only one who can make the decision what is best , considering, experience, tools available, computer savvy, computer tuning tables, what your time is worth, and how much hair you can afford to lose, Good luck!
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