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Brake drum removal???

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by 66Tuxman, Nov 27, 2004.

  1. Nov 27, 2004
    66Tuxman

    66Tuxman Call me the Tuxman.

    Near Albany NY
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    Nov 12, 2004
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    Ok I did a search in these forums and found a 3 page thread that got me more confused on what I was supposed to do than when I got into it. My question is how do you remove the brake drums on a 1966 CJ-5 Tuxedo park. As of now I took the wheels off both sides and thats about it. In some posts I saw you need to take out the axle locking mechanism(hub)??? The haynes manual did not cover really anything on this subject. I really dont have a clue as to how I am supposed to take them off. I would think they would come off rather easilly but they havint so a few suggestions would be nice. Also I plan on reusing the drums and I already know that the brake shoes have not worn into it. Thanks :?
     
  2. Nov 27, 2004
    schardein

    schardein Low Range Therapy

    Success, MO
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    Aug 11, 2003
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    Assuming you have original brakes, sometimes the brake drums are swaged on. This means that your lug nut studs, where they pass through the drum, have splines. These spines bind the studs to the drum. Also, the mechanic may have "peened" this area with a punch and hammer. This is stock setup.

    May also just be rusted on. Look carefully at the area where the studs pass through and you may be able to tell.

    If so (swaged), the right approach is a special cutter that you use with an electric drill. Yeah, I don't have one either.

    You can still remove the drum by removing the entire hub.

    If you have a drive flange (no lockouts) remove the 6 bolts. If you have lockouts, remove it, usually by the same six bolts (there are different designs of lockouts). Then you will have a locknut, washer, then adjusting nut. You need a big a$$ socket especially for this. Ain't got one, buy one, you will need it. The washer will have had part of it bent over locking the nut in place. Use a small screwdriver, punch and hammer, or stick of dynamite to straighten it so the outer nut can be removed. Then off comes the washer, then the inner nut, then slide the whole hub/drum off.

    Beer time. It has actually been awhile since I have done this service, so I may have missed a detail. I'm sure someone will chime in.
     
  3. Nov 27, 2004
    schardein

    schardein Low Range Therapy

    Success, MO
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    Oh yeah forgot to add, most drum brakes, you just slide off the drum. This "swaging" business is OLD school.

    If it is just rusted on, some kanokroil, pb blaster, wd40 what have you--soak it, carefully pry along the edge of the drum and backing plate with a large prybar/screwdriver (LARGE), or the correct route is a 3 jaw puller. A little heat is needed sometimes. This won't work if they are swaged on.

    If you end up replacing the drum, don't just drive out the studs with a big punch and hammer without first grinding down the splines (if they were swaged), you will ruin the hubs. You will spread out the holes so the lug nut studs won't fit tight. Ask me how I know. See the nice new hubs on my -5? (well they were new in '98 when I learned this)
     
  4. Nov 27, 2004
    66Tuxman

    66Tuxman Call me the Tuxman.

    Near Albany NY
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    Nov 12, 2004
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    Thanks, that really cleared everything up. Man you guys are so helpfull. :D


    Beers all around on me :stout: :stout: :stout:
     
  5. Nov 27, 2004
    tdobson

    tdobson Tom

    Hampton, Va.
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    Nov 7, 2004
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    there is a snap ring on the axle you have to remove to get the inner part of the locking hub off...hard to see if it's covered with grease
     
  6. Feb 10, 2005
    John A. Shows

    John A. Shows Comic Relief

    Mendenhall...
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    OK, I read this thread three times and saved it to a word file, but still don't understand....

    I'm trying to get my drums off so I can replace the brake shoes. Are you saying that I have to remove my whole axle assembly?
     
  7. Feb 10, 2005
    w3srl

    w3srl All-around swell dude Staff Member

    Port Orange, FL
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    No, John. Just remove either the drive flange or the outer lockout hub with the six bolts Greg described. Then you remove the big honkin' nuts that hold the wheel bearings onto the spindle. The hub/drum assembly will then slide off the spindle and the spindle/stub axle will remain in place.

    On the rears, you will almost certainly need a hub puller. Remove the cotter pin that locks the axle nut, and then use a big honkin' socket (preferably with a 3/4" drive ratchet/breaker bar) to loosen the axle nut. Leave the nut on a good couple of turns, because otherwise when the hub breaks loose it will fly across the shop. Ask me how I know this one! There really isn't a good way to break the hub loose, other than using the three-jawed hub puller that bolts onto the wheel studs. Som folks swear by backing the hub nut off and then driving down a bumpy street, but I don't advocate that method for safety reasons. :shock:

    Clear as mud?

    <edit>

    Oh, and don't forget to coat the rear axle taper/key with anti-seize before you put it back together. ;)
     
  8. Feb 10, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    Is this what you poor Ba#$%%rds have to go thru to get the drums off the 9" brakes and the 2 piece axles.:shock: man the 10" drums and the 1 piece axles are nothing like this. The 1 piece rear axle is remove lug nuts, remove wheel, whack with hammer and pull drum off. The front was the same way.
     
  9. Feb 10, 2005
    John A. Shows

    John A. Shows Comic Relief

    Mendenhall...
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    I have 10" brakes as well McRuff. And right now I'm working on the front brakes. I have lockouts.
     
  10. Feb 10, 2005
    John A. Shows

    John A. Shows Comic Relief

    Mendenhall...
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    Clear as mud....

    I need pictures I guess.
     
  11. Feb 10, 2005
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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    John, they're telling you to leave the drum on the hub and remove the hub instead.

    Assume the tires and wheels are off. On the front, if you take the Warn "hub" off, there is a snap ring and 2 big nuts. Take the snap ring off and the two nuts off, and the whole hub will slide off the spindle. This is the same process you follow when you repack the front wheel bearings. It's a good idea to repack the wheel bearings and replace the grease seal when you do this.

    On the rear, there's a big nut that holds the spindle to the axle. Remove (loosen) that nut and use a puller to pull the hub and drum off the end of the axle. Takes a lot of force and a stout puller.

    If the drums can be turned, they can be turned without removing the drum from the hub. Take the whole asembly to your machine shop. Be sure and clean out any turnings before you reassemble though.
     
  12. Feb 10, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    John I have lockouts to, but if you don't want to take the hub off you should be able to just pull the drum off the front and get it turned as the shop should have a flange to fit your hub on the machine. If your just changing shoes or something like that the drum should just come off without taking any of the lockout hub parts or anything else off.
     
  13. Feb 10, 2005
    John A. Shows

    John A. Shows Comic Relief

    Mendenhall...
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    From what I can tell McRuff, the hub and brake drum are pressed together with flanges on the lug studs, and if I separate them they're not going to go back together without being pressed together.

    My drivers side front was removed with a BFH hitting on the lug studs and 4 of them are loose and wobbling.

    Does anyone think I can have them pressed back together or do I need to buy a new brake drum for this wheel?

    Seems like someone earlier in this thread said they'd separated their and had to buy a new drum.
     
  14. Feb 10, 2005
    lynn

    lynn Time machine / Early CJ5 HR Rep Staff Member

    Huntingdon PA
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    Sounds like you'll be buying a new hub :(
     
  15. Feb 10, 2005
    w3srl

    w3srl All-around swell dude Staff Member

    Port Orange, FL
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    ...and a set of studs and a drum. It's surprising how easy it is to bend a hub on one of these Jeeps.
     
  16. Feb 10, 2005
    John A. Shows

    John A. Shows Comic Relief

    Mendenhall...
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    Why a new hub?

    It's been running like this for a while and once you get the wheel on doesn't everything get tight again?

    I may have mistated that. The BFH was used to beat on the ends of the studs while prying out on the brake drum. The mechanic apparently didn't know the trick of removing the hub and drum together. He separated the drum from the hub while it was on the vehicle.

    When he done this the studs were simply driven back through the hub a little bit. And when mounting a wheel I'd have thought that the stud would have sucked back into the hub and the drum but apparently it doesn't.

    I was thinking that if I remove the hub, and take the hub and brake drum to a shop I could have them press the two back together.

    Wrong????

    Oh yeah...what are the chances that this is part of my vibration problem?
     
  17. Feb 10, 2005
    budtoh3zo

    budtoh3zo Member

    little...
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    You can probibly get the studs pressed back in and i dont see if it never got bent why you would have to buy a new one. When u get it off just look it over take it to a machineist and have him check it.
     
  18. Feb 10, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    If you guys are having to do this to pull the front drum I would get new studs pressed in without the flange to lock it to the drum so you can just pull the drum after the wheel is off, I would be very pi##ed off if I had to do this every time I wanted to pull the drum to inspect my brakes.
    Edit: I just went and checked the drums and spare hubs in the garage, if the serrations on the studs are sticking out past the hubs, then you should file this area off so the drum does not stick to them, as it is not suppose to at all!!!!!!!!! This will eliminate the problem of the drum not wanting to comme off the hub once the lug nuts and wheel are removed.
     
  19. Feb 10, 2005
    John A. Shows

    John A. Shows Comic Relief

    Mendenhall...
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    I was thinking that same thing McRuff.

    OK on to hub removal now....is it hard to remove the hub? Am I going to have to have a puller to do that?
     
  20. Feb 10, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    No John all you will have to do is remove the bolts on the end of the warn or whatever locking hubs that hold the dial on, remove the snap ring on the end of the axle (if there is one) some have them some don't, then remove the locking mechanisk for the hubs, remove the 6 bolts that hold the locking hub body to the axle hub, then there is a washer in there with a bent tab or 2 to hold the nut from turning, take a screw driver and a hammer and bend or tap the washer back flat, then untighten the nut (preferably with a spindle socket for this purpose (2 1/16" I think) remove the inner nut (same size) and flat washer, then pull the axle hub off, the outer bearing will then be loose and fall out, the inner bearing will be held in place due to the seal on the back of the hub.

    Its that simple, don't forget to bend the tabs back upon reassembly and to regrease the bearings if necessary and to replace the rear seal if necessary.

    Good Luck!!!!
     
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