1. Registration trouble? Please use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom right corner of the page and your issue will be resolved.
    Dismiss Notice

Saginaw Steering

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Steve's 70-5, Apr 23, 2018.

  1. Apr 23, 2018
    termin8ed

    termin8ed I didn't do it Staff Member

    Mason, MI
    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2002
    Messages:
    4,422
    Just make sure the mount is solid on the frame:whistle:
    I just found out this afternoon the sway steer ive had was because the mount was moving. I only had 2 bolts thru the frame/mount/box. I ended up welding the mount to the top of the frame and made all the difference
     
  2. Apr 23, 2018
    Howard Eisenhauer

    Howard Eisenhauer Administrator Staff Member

    Tantallon, Nova...
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2003
    Messages:
    8,126
    If you don't want to make those changes then you might want to consider rebuilding the Ross setup & adding power assist like Nate did-

    Ted's Steering Upgrade, With A Twist

    The downside to the Ross is maintenance & wear but with fresh components they steer as well as anything else; the power assist will virtually eliminate most of the wear issues.
     
  3. Apr 23, 2018
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,784
    What do you have for exhaust? That will determine the brackets coming off the head......................The steering input shaft coming from the column can go above or below the cross member..........although going through the cross member gets you the best angle to the column with a minimum of U-joints and also better sets up the Pittman arm in height..........still may not clear your winch depending on size...............
     
  4. Apr 23, 2018
    Don X

    Don X The Prodigal Moderator Staff Member 2023 Sponsor

    San Diego,...
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2007
    Messages:
    3,383
    Power steeri g must be nice but it's not all that. A member to go nameless blew a hose part way in to the Rubicon. Had to hightail it out of there. In the meantime, my manual Ross got me through. My arms were tired but it got me through.
     
  5. Apr 23, 2018
    Don X

    Don X The Prodigal Moderator Staff Member 2023 Sponsor

    San Diego,...
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2007
    Messages:
    3,383
    Oh! Then there was the Canyon of Death I had to turn around in out near Truckhaven. I'll leave the details to Jim if he's so inclined.
     
  6. Apr 23, 2018
    Don X

    Don X The Prodigal Moderator Staff Member 2023 Sponsor

    San Diego,...
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2007
    Messages:
    3,383
    Just remembered on my first Rubicon trip by the time I got to the top of Cadillac hill the splines on my sector shaft were twisted to the point I could barely turn to the left. Had to do 4, 5 and 6 point turns in some cases.
     
  7. Apr 24, 2018
    Steve's 70-5

    Steve's 70-5 Active Member

    Louisville, Ky
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2009
    Messages:
    1,383

    I have original V6 exhaust, drivers side is front dump. The winch is a Koeing, I have a 5/16 inch plate that bolts to the under side of the front bumper and bolts under the frame by the grill. I had to cut the bumper to get the fairlead in.
     
  8. Apr 24, 2018
    Steve's 70-5

    Steve's 70-5 Active Member

    Louisville, Ky
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2009
    Messages:
    1,383
    Here is the winch mounted

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    With the front bellcranck gone may be able to move the winch over some.

    Anyone have a measurement of how far the sag box is off the frame rail?
     
  9. Apr 24, 2018
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Messages:
    5,349
    Once the bellcrank is removed there should be plenty of room to move the winch and add saginaw steering. As far as cutting up the column, hunt down a postal jeep from 1975 back and take the column out, it is nearly a direct bolt in and used saginaw steering stock so it hooks up fine and is the same diameter of column and mount for the dash. I put a postal column in mine back in 2006 when I did my saginaw steering.
     
  10. Apr 24, 2018
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,784
    Looks busy up there with that PTO drive shaft going right through the area where a Drag Link & Pittman arm also needs to reside ...............Might be enough room Saginaw 4-bolt #800 about 5.750" wide and 11" long not including the front splined input shaft.....should fit just have to move things around...........everything is a compromise

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Apr 24, 2018
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Messages:
    5,349
    Another view point:

    Saginaw jeep.JPG
     
  12. Apr 24, 2018
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Messages:
    4,517
    Ohhhh, Strong Hands. Bought 8 of those a couple weeks back for gluing up woodwork in the house. Needed something strong that one end would fit in a inch high space. Worked perfect.

    Sorry Steve-------
     
  13. Apr 25, 2018
    garage gnome

    garage gnome ECJ5 welder

    Western MA
    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2009
    Messages:
    3,092
    I agree. You should have plenty of room under the winch for this to work. Why everyone hates the ross system is beyond me. :shrug: Its fine with with some maintenance and proper upkeep.
     
  14. Apr 25, 2018
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

    At the foot of...
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2010
    Messages:
    7,186
    The Ross system works ok with little or no lift and stock-ish sized tires, assuming all components are in good condition.
    When you get into a lift & bigger tires, it's limitations become apparent.
     
  15. Apr 25, 2018
    Howard Eisenhauer

    Howard Eisenhauer Administrator Staff Member

    Tantallon, Nova...
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2003
    Messages:
    8,126
    Per the OP-

    I don't think twisting jumbo mudders in rocky trenches is going to be an issue here :D

    Certainly a Saggy in good shape is superior to a Ross in bad shape but as for the superiority of a saggy over a power assisted de-slopped Ross (even with jumbo mudders) I don't think that's been established. The OP has stated he doesn't want to cut up the cross member- the power retrofit to the Ross provides an option to avoid that. :)
     
  16. Apr 25, 2018
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Messages:
    5,349
    My crossmember has no cuts in it. My setup has the spud shaft going under the crossmember, with only a small notch in the frame motor mount, has good angles on the steering shaft and my drag link and front tierod is straight with no bump steer. You really don’t need the steering box that high up on the frame, if you hit it on rocks like mine is mounted you have bigger problems such as your front shackle already being destroyed.
     
    mike starck likes this.
  17. Apr 25, 2018
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

    At the foot of...
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2010
    Messages:
    7,186
    I agree....mine is mounted lower too and the shafts runs just under the cross member. I even managed to get it in there with the factory front dump exhaust manifold and Y pipe.
    Yes the box is low, but it's higher than the leaf spring and shackle right next to it and the front tie rod and axle right behind it.
    I've never hit it on a rock and I do some fairly tough trails.
     
    mike starck likes this.
  18. Apr 25, 2018
    Steve's 70-5

    Steve's 70-5 Active Member

    Louisville, Ky
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2009
    Messages:
    1,383
    Sounds good, your kit is sounding better.
     
  19. Apr 25, 2018
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Active Member

    Sacramento Ca.
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2016
    Messages:
    1,450
    My cross member is not cut either, the steering shaft goes under it. I could see a slight possibility of a rock hitting my pitman arm, but not very likely. I think the tie-rod and drag link flip help that situation as well.

    Here are pics of mine.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    FinoCJ likes this.
  20. Apr 25, 2018
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Messages:
    5,349
    These were taken back in 2005 or so.

    Sag-8.jpg

    Sag-3.jpg

    Sag-4.jpg

    Sag5.jpg
     
    melvinm likes this.
New Posts