1971 Cj5 Steering Box Conversion Advice Needed

My wife just picked up a 1971 CJ5 with the Buick 225, turbo 350 tranny, & wide 33" tires. Previous owner installed power steering with a Toyota tilt steering column and power brakes (it came factory with no ps or pb). It has the GM style Saginaw ps pump. I'm a Ford guy and have never worked on or owned a Jeep before, so I'm a newbie when it comes to Jeeps and I need some help.

The steering is so sloppy you can turn the wheel 90* without any movement of the tires. I assume this is a steering box issue. From all the research I've done so far, 71 Jeeps came with a Ross steering box, which inherently has a lot of slop in it. My wife is scared to drive this thing because of all the slop, and honestly it makes me very nervous driving it myself also. And now with snow on the ground she is even more scared to drive it.

From what I understand, a common conversion is to install a Saginaw steering box. Is this correct? But where do I find this steering box? I guess a more accurate question would be, what year of Jeep (or any other make of vehicle) can I locate a Saginaw steering box (I would prefer to buy it from an auto parts store as opposed to scavenging a wrecking yard). Also, what other components will I need to locate to complete this conversion? I'd like to keep this a bolt on process as much as I can, but I can do fab work if need be.

From what I understand, buying the steering box would be the easy part as I've read that there's a lot involved in doing this swap. Can any of you provide detailed step by step advice/info or a website or forum article that gives detailed instructions on what needs to be done for the swap?

It looks like someone boxed the frame where the steering box is mounted and the steering box is mounted using washers as spacers. Or maybe it's the factory setup??? I have no idea because I'm not familiar with Jeeps. Heck, I'm not even sure if the steering box is the factory Ross box, as I have no idea what it looks like. I assume it's the factory box and steering shaft, as it has a rag joint. Did the factory setup us a rag joint?

Another issue it has besides the sloppy steering is the power steering not smooth and seems to grab when trying to turn the wheel. Not sure if this is because of air in the system or if it has the wrong fluid in the pump. Can someone advise what the problem is and provide a solution?

I would appreciate any help you could provide. Thanks....

 

OK, If it already has a PS conversion the ross box and bell crank are gone. Let's look at what you have. With that much slop there should be several bad joint noticeable. Have some one turn the wheel and look at the shaft going from the firewall to the PS box are the joints tight? if they are check all joints from the bottom to the steering box out to the wheel and tie rods.
And yes pix are going to be needed to help.

Jay

 

I took pics of the steering box with my phone and tried to upload them, but I got an error message stating that the file was too large. I have no idea how to make the file smaller so I can post it. Any advice on this. I can get you whatever pictures you need if you can help me figure out how to post them.

 

First off if it has Power steering it's not the factory Ross steering................like mentioned above Pictures........will help.

As far as all the movement in the system...........could be an accumulation of wear from some or all the components from the steering column all the way to the spindles where the tires are mounted.............easy test , engine off, have someone jump in the driver's seat and slowly move the steering wheel L / R of center while a second person is following the movement down from the column through the steering gear through the Pittman arm & drag link tie rod ends to the spindles out where the tires are mounted.......an inch of movement at the steering wheel should give your a near proportional movement downstream.........the parts that are loose or worn out will show up..

Pictures.

 

We have a thread (in the "Builds" forum) specifically devoted to the Saginaw steering conversion -

Saginaw power steering (pics) please add yours!!

There is plenty to examine there.

If you want to buy all the parts new, you can. Steering gears can come from either Jeeps or a variety of GM cars. Both Ididit and Flaming River make complete steering columns that can replace what you have with new parts. There are plenty of steering parts available, targeted at hot rod builders, and you can find them on the speed equipment sites like Jegs, Summit Racing, and Speedway Motors.

 

The forum will host your pictures if you drag-and-drop, but that feature may not be available to new members. If you have the pics on a site like PhotoBucket, just post a link and we can click through to see them. Or you can hot link from another site onto the page - instructions for that are in the "Forum Help" forum.

 

I don't have the pics on another site (like photobucket), they are on my computer (transferred from my phone). But I'll get on photobucket and create an account and upload the pictures for you. Give me a little bit to work on this. I suspect I'll need to take more pictures for you guys, but I'll post what I have for now (once I get photobucket setup) and you can advise what pictures you need.

 

Ok, here are the pictures I uploaded to photobucket. Not sure if I did this correctly, but here's the link...I think. Let me know what steering box I have and what's been done. From your comments, this isn't the factory Ross steering box. If not, what is it? And is this the factory mounting location? Anything else I need to know?

1971 Jeep CJ5 by FORDGEARHEAD

 

Focker....I checked out your write-up. Very good article. I noticed you have a double U-Joint on your steering shaft. I only have one and it's at a steep angle as it connects to the steering shaft. Would this have anything to do with the herky-jerky steering (steering wheel grabs when I turn it) or is it more a problem of air in the lines or wrong fluid in the pump? I've heard people say not to use ps fluid, but rather tranny fluid in the ps pump. Advise???

 

Yes it's a Saginaw Steering gear with a Saginaw Pump...............When the snow melts get a friend over and check out the steering system like I mentioned above...........also around that steering gear mount look for flex between it and the frame...........worn out suspension rubber joints or loose springs can also attribute to the excess motion............lots to look at there.

 

Thanks Tarry99. Appreciate your input. I'll drag the wife out there tomorrow and have her turn the steering wheel back and forth and inspect the steering joints. Glad to know it's already been upgraded to the Saginaw box. That saves a lot of fabrication and expense. So now it sounds like maybe it's just worn out steering joints, tie rods, wheel bearings or ??? a combination of everything.

Any idea of why it has herky-jerky steering (steering wheel grabs when I turn it)? Is it more a problem of air in the lines or wrong fluid in the pump? I've heard people say not to use ps fluid, but rather tranny fluid in the ps pump. I have no idea what fluid is in the pump. We have only owned this thing for 3 weeks and haven't messed with it yet. Any advise???

 

You also have a rag joint and what looks like a factory bell coupling to your steering box, these are both known to produce a lot of slop from wear.

 

Great info guys. Thank you. So I'll crawl under this thing tomorrow and see what's going on.

 

me too

 

You may not be totally out of the woods yet on the fact that the steering gear has already been installed............some folks that do this modification pay little attention to some obvious basic geometry when they mount the box which can also hinder its overall performance later............take some decent pictures of how the column exits the firewall , the joint attached there and the angle of said joint as it goes forward towards the input shaft........converting that joint over to a more acceptable Double D style U joint that will easily adapt to a collapsible steering shaft between the firewall and input shaft is of great benefit in the event of a frontal impact.

Take pictures from the side of the steering gear showing the rake or angle going forward from the input shaft , including the joint there..............the mounting location of the gear box on the frame rail as will as the tilting up of the gearbox to lessen the joint angle going forward as will as what that adjustment does to the sector shaft and Pitman arm all have to be considered to counteract bump steer while braking...........which is caused by a Drag link that is either too high or low as compared with the opposite end..............In a perfect world if you were looking rearward from in front of the front axle........you would want the drag link to be a little higher on the gear box Pitman arm side as compared to the passenger spindle side..........assuming you have cross over steering?..........The more pictures of various angles the better.

 

I'm not saying the rag joint is completely bad, but they are prone to wear from large tires and impacts from wheeling. The bell coupling on the other hand is a piece of cheap crap.