Solution found for 225 to 98

I just got back from the guys at www.novak-adapt.com about a plate for 225 oddfire to mate to a t-98. For under 400$ there mating the t98 to an adapter plate to the 225 bellhousing to a full size 14" clutch plate and will have it back to me bt the end of the week. There also prepared to ship the kit to anyone whos interested.

 

yes its the f head 98, no swapping of anykind, just the installing of the novak spacer plate between the bell hsng and trannie to shorten the shaft. With the price they also included the new 14" clutch, and clutch plate.

 

Really?? I have a couple of t-98 input shafts (f-134 and 6 cyl 230) input shafts on the workbench and the f-134 shaft looks like it would be too short, not too long.


Now, the t-98 input shaft for the 230 engine would be about the correct length for the V-6 and probably need a little adapter to 'shorten' it.

If the F-134 shaft is adaptable to the V-6 without a spud shaft I'd be really interested in hearing about it.

edit --

The more I think about it, if you deleted the current long adapter that is on the t-14 and put in a shorter adapter for the t-98, it might just fit. I may just call Novak tomorrow....

 

Unless the T98 is from a 715 then the input is long but that tranny has a remote transfercase.

 

Kodiak--

I'm not 100% positive, but I believe that the 6 cylinder 230 engine t-98 input shaft and the 715 input shaft are not the same length. I can get a FSN for the 715 shaft, but have not been able to get an OEM number for it (yet).

The reason I say they are different is that I have a t-98 from a m715 sitting on the floor in the shop that has the input shaft still installed in it and from measuring the three shafts it appears that the 715 shaft is different from the F-134 shaft and the 6 cyl 230 shaft.

The reason that I say I'm not 100% sure is that I suppose that the t-98 from the 715 could have had a different input shaft swapped in - I wouldn't know since I got the transmission in its current configuration from a guy that had no idea of the history behind the trans.

 

Kaiser made two 230's. One was for the civi Wagon/ Pickup and the military one was for the 715. They are different although I'm not sure if some things interchange. Input shaft length and configuration could be one, I don't know. Have not had one apart. The input for a T98 4 cyl application is very short.

 

I know that the rear driveshaft would be SUPER short, but could you theoretically make the correct length spacer and bolt a T-98 from a 715 up to an F head? I know that they have a divorced t-case, but what about trying to adapt a t-case to it via AA or novak? Also, wonder what type of clutch, pressure plate, adapter, etc. would be needed between the F head and T-98? Just thinking out loud here, any comments?

 

Right now when you pull a T98 from the back of a F Head 134, the shaft is longer than you need it to mount it to a 225 fly wheel and clutch by about 3/4" to 1". The Novak guys built a plate to mount the 225 bellhousing to the T98's face where the 134 housing was. (it wont fit otherwise, tried). The other option is to drill the bellhousing from the 225 to make it mate and then cut the 98's shaft down.

I know all the books say a 225 came with a 98, but I call shenanigans. Theres no possible way to mate these 2 together, I tried every option I could including ruining a good 98 and 2 225 bellhousings before I gave up and called them.

 

They did come together as an option but The T-98 had a different input shaft and an adapter between the trans case and the bellhousing. I've seen two of them and had the opportunity to purchase one but didn't have the extra money at the time. Nickmil.

 

they're out there, just not in any great quantity......
I've seen one !

 

here's a pic showing both adapters
jeepngem adapted his T18 by puchasing the adapters from Jeep....while they were still available

 

So, #24 and #49 are the "missing links" that one would need in order to try to mate a T-18 to a 225 and an F134 and t-case, or just a 225?

And what about the T-98 from a 715 going behind an F head? I have never heard of an adapter to get a t-case on the back of the divorced T-98 tranny.

 

To mate to a 225 you need #24, #25, and #29, the adapter, front bearing retainer, and input shaft for that application. To mate to a Jeep 18 or 20 transfer case you need the output shaft which is listed as #3 but the pic also shows all the gears, synchro assemblies, etc as #3, and # 49 the adapter to the transfer case. Nickmil

 

You don't need a new main shaft (output shaft).

Main shaft is the same betweeen 4 wd and 2wd, the only difference being the adapter.

There is only one Warner part number for the t-98 main shaft for all applications of the T-98. This includes jeep and non jeep vehicles.

The Jeep part number for T-98 equipped CJ5, FC-150, FC170, Wagoneer, and trucks is the same regardless of whether it is a 2wd application or 4WD application.

To adapt a non jeep t-98 to a jeep you'd need the bearing retainer, front adapter(this would have to be modified a little, or bolted in backwards), rear adapter, and input shaft.

UNLESS YOU HAVE A CJ-6!. With a cj-6 you could get away with the M715 version with the divorced transfer case. You'd have some fab work, but there'd be enough room under it to have the extra drive shaft...

kamel

edit --
The M-715 input shaft is not the same as the f-134, nor is it the same as the 230 6 cylinder either. The 230 6 cylinder input shaft is the same as the FC-170 version of the T-98

 

Sorry Kamel but have to disagree on the main shaft. I've run into Ford T-98's that had a completely different main shaft than needed for the Jeep application. I hunted like crazy to find one for Dr. Verne when he was putting a Ford T-98 behind a Flathead Ford V-8 in a Willys Wagon. Fortunately I was able to find the rare bugger for him. The Jeep ones could be the same, not at all sure there, but the Ford ones I've run into were not the same. Nickmil.

 

You can easly mate a 18 to a 225 without the above mentioned parts. By turning down(to acccept the GM piliot bushing)and slightly shortining the(Ford) input shaft, then turning down the input bearing retainer to fit the GM hole. When using the later Ford bolt pattern, slightly open the two top holes, then fill and drill the bottom two webs inside the bellhousing. You then tap the trans housing to accept the bolts from the inside. The overall bellhousing/trans length using the short GM bellhousing is about 3/4" longer than a T14 with the stock adapter. While I don't know about the 98 input shaft, the rest of procedure should work for the F motor. The only drawback is that you have to pull the engine to do any cluch work which I prefer anyway.

 

Absolutely correct except you don't need to shorten the input shaft to mate to the 225. The key here is to use the Ford input that necks down after the splines on the tranny side so the clutch disc doesn't run out of splines. Due to the thickness of the flywheel on the 225, if you use an input that doesn't neck down the disc may run into the end of where the splines are cut and cause the clutch to bind or the tranny to not go in all the way. You do need to open up the GM pilot bushing to accept the Ford pilot. You can also modify the case so the the trans bolts to the bellhousing from the tranny side so the tranny can be removed easily pretty much by doing what you described. I've literally done this dozens of times and works very well. Nickmil.

 

Thanks for the info guys, keep it coming. I am trying to get a 4 speed or some other type of gearing in a jeep of mine with an F134, T-90, D 18, and 4.27 gears in the diffs. It is just not low enough!

 

That's interesting. When I did this conversion I installed the input in the empty case and installed it in the bell housing. The trans wouldn't go completely in due to the input bottoming on the pilot bushing. I was forced to cut it back a bit farther(can't remember how far, I did this in 90). The reason I opted to turn the input to accept the stock pilot bushing is to keep as many of the components stock as I could. This eases future replacement considerably.