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Willys Wagon

Discussion in 'Jeep Truck and FC Tech' started by Jon B., Jun 2, 2022.

  1. Nov 11, 2022
    Tralehead

    Tralehead Member

    Silverado, CA
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    Nov 7, 2022
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    176
    Have you seen the discussion on OWF regarding aftermarket dealer installed turn signals? I'd bet those holes once served that purpose. Just saw an early Truck that still had them, owner mentioned that it was fairly common. Hood holds were the same after folks complained about the wind wobble over 45mph. One of my wagons never had the latches, and I can attest to the hood dancing. Thinking some 80mil butyl deadener would add enough weight to compensate(?)
     
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  2. Nov 24, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Apr 6, 2022
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    253
    Yesterday, I placed an order with Jeepsterman for the 2” suspension setup - springs, shackles, shocks, etc.

    The front springs are flat, the u-bolts are encrusted with rust, the shocks are likely 40 years old, and the front end needed to be raised to get some clearance for the driveshaft and differential housing.

    The site says Free Shipping, but doesn’t mention a $50 Handling Charge; a bit disappointed about that but it’s minor, compared to what I’ll spend to get the wagon on the road.

    Once the plasma cutter is back from repair, I’ll get the puller cut & welded to remove the rear hubs. There’s little doubt that the rear brakes will need a lot of TLC.
     
  3. Nov 24, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Apr 6, 2022
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    253
    One more thing…

    There’s a set of hanging pedals in the shop that came from member “bkapp” to me. The plan is for them to go in the wagon, but I really have only a small clue as to how. The firewall will no doubt need a reinforcing plate and a support at the dash will be fabricated.

    There’s a new master cylinder on the shelf, as well as a hydraulic clutch setup that will probably get used.

    I guess I’ll start by removing the current pedals, brake and clutch linkage and see what’s needed to install the new stuff.

    I asked about this over on OWF but it didn’t get any traction. Maybe here it will.

    Jon B.
     
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  4. Nov 25, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Apr 6, 2022
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    Is cross-posting allowed here? Some forum admins frown on it… I also put this post in the “What did you do to your Jeep today” subforum. If it’s forbidden, I’ll delete one or the other. jb
    ————

    I started the hanging pedal part of the project.

    Got a 6”x9” piece of 10 ga. plate cut & smoothed. (Using an angle grinder & cut-off wheel is slow compared to a plasma cutter.)

    The hanging pedals, if mounted where I want them, will fall within a half-inch of where the existing pedals are when “at rest”. That’s a Good Thing.

    The existing fuse panel will have to be relocated, but it’ll get replaced by a modern one, with spade-type fuses.

    The steering column could pose a bit of trouble but nothing insurmountable. It may (key word) be less traumatic than I first thought…

    Jon B.
     
  5. Dec 14, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Apr 6, 2022
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    Today, I finished the front suspension upgrade. The new, 2” lift leaf springs are on, new hardware, shackles and shocks, as well.

    One rear leaf is hanging on the pivot and shackle, waiting for the paint to dry on the bottom plate/shock mount so that the u-bolts can go on.

    One thing I noticed while under the back end: the floor of the wagon has a “hump” for the differential housing to clear if the suspension is completely bottomed out. However, the hump is in the center of the body, while the rear differential is an offset D44. Hmmm.

    With the new lift, this thing is really gonna go through the Minnesota snow! Well, not *this* winter, but…

    Jon B.
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2022
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  6. Dec 14, 2022
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    From the factory, Willy Wagons have a centered rear axle, even though they use a Dana 18 offset transfer case. The long driveshaft works fine with this mis-match.
    The only rear axle I can think of with a wider offset D44 is a CJ7 with a Quadratrac.
    -Donny
     
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  7. Dec 14, 2022
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
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    Sep 17, 2009
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    You forgot the "wide tread" 58 to 64 FC 150 axle. Offset and same nominal width WMS/WMS (57") as the wagons.
     
  8. Dec 14, 2022
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
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    Jul 18, 2013
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    We're gonna want to see photos
     
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  9. Dec 15, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Apr 6, 2022
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    Like these, maybe?

    BF003633-B2C1-444E-BB5D-4BFDAF8BD707.jpeg

    CE195556-BCBE-4B90-93B0-D3F83EFD5320.jpeg

    88E39840-F2C9-4870-8E81-699FCE8F6799.jpeg

    Jon B.
     
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  10. Dec 15, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Does this mean that my rear axle is a transplant? That’s not hard to believe, as lots of other things don’t belong: engine, front clip, doors and such…

    Jon B.
     
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  11. Dec 17, 2022
    Flat47

    Flat47 Member

    THE County, Maine
    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2006
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    Not so. Wagons have offset rear diffs.
     
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  12. Dec 17, 2022
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Sep 21, 2002
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    Yep, that's how mine is.
     
  13. Dec 18, 2022
    Tralehead

    Tralehead Member

    Silverado, CA
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    Very little, but it's there. Need a measuring tape to actually see it, less than 2" I think
    @Jon B.
    How mangled is your original pedal control shaft that you removed from the frame?
     
  14. Dec 19, 2022
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    This is what mine is too. Mine is offset by about 2”. Hard to tell its even offset without putting a tape measure on it. Both my ‘60 and ‘62 show a slight offset. I can’t easily get to my ‘57 to check it. Either way, my axles are no where near as offset as those pictured in post #69. I measure 13.5” and 11.5” from the center casting to the nearest U-bolt. Yes, it is offset, but the center casting still falls under the hump in the load floor. Move it over 1” and its centered. This might be a “late model” thing.
    -Donny
     
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  15. Dec 19, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    I haven’t removed the pedal shaft from the frame, yet. Soon, tho - although tomorrow’s high temp looks to be -2F! That might be ugly in an unheated shop.

    When it comes out, I’ll try to be gentle with it, so as to salvage it. I’m trying to preserve every stock piece that comes off - except rubber brake lines, etc.

    Jon B.
     
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  16. Dec 19, 2022
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    My measurement matches yours, although the 2" difference is actually easiest to understand (in my mind anyway) by measuring the axle tubes. One side is longer by 2" so 1/2 of that is 1".
     
  17. Dec 19, 2022
    Tralehead

    Tralehead Member

    Silverado, CA
    Joined:
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    And I'm complaining about 48F...
    Yeah, my sister tried Jackson, MN, where her husband's family farm was. I think she lasted less than 2 years then moved to Phoenix. From the deep freeze to the fire! Ended up in Prescott, 4 seasons but not nearly as drastic. You're a braver man than me Gunga Din! But at least you have a shop... I'm shade tree here in SoCal, groveling in the gravel.

    That rear end is looking crustier than mine after some Tecate and bad tacos! But that muffler... Now that's a keeper ;)

    I inquired about the pedal shafts but then did a search and found pretty much all of it is out there as repop. IMHO you've got the right idea with the hangers, even tho I'm keeping the stockers. But my P.O. was a bit more conscientious and used the Advanced Adapters chain drive clutch thingy. Mounts to the frame and uses Heim joints to make it all work like a charm. And grumpy ol cwdtmmrs on OWF convinced me to keep the stock M/C. He's got 4 wheel disc with remote assist on his wagon and it stops like a dream (I got to drive it). After braving the cold here I came to the conclusion that my pedals might need to be bushed, but with less than an 1/8" side play it's low on the list.
    I would have to concur that the rear axle looks aftermarket. Hopefully the ratios match?
    Anxiously await your opinion on the spring kit!
     
  18. Dec 31, 2022
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Hmmm…

    The axle housing measurements on my ‘53 wagon are as such:

    Right side - passenger in US: 13” from differential housing to brake backing plate.

    Left side - driver in US: 25” from differential housing to brake backing plate.

    12 inches difference, so 6” offset.

    The rear driveshaft is not angled between the transfer case and the differential.

    Jon B.

    Ps: the front axle ratio is 5.38 - 43/8.
     
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  19. Jan 1, 2023
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    Anybody else have a Wagon with the heavy-offset rear axle? Like I posted above, you almost need a tape measure to tell mine’s even offset the 2”.
    -Donny
     
  20. Feb 11, 2023
    Jon B.

    Jon B. Retired three times; still working.

    SW Minnesota
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    Ok, gang, I have yet another question (yes, you’re all shocked; I know).

    The hydraulic clutch setup I have won’t work for a number of reasons. The hanging pedals are about to be installed in the wagon - the originals are out. Rather than a series of push/pull rods and bell cranks, I’m thinking about a cable for the clutch release. Several vendors list them for early and intermediate CJs; why not use one for a ‘53 Willys wagon?

    The clutch pedal has an arm on both front and back, so it can either pull or push. The one question is, I guess, does it have enough travel to use just a cable. Or, will it need a bell crank to provide additional mechanical travel? Hmmm… I guess I could extend the ‘pull’ arm.

    Or… Should I drop a couple hundred bux on a universal clutch master/slave kit?

    Recall, if you will, that this thing has a Ford 260 V8 and an adapter to the original transmission. I presume there’s a Ford clutch plate, arm and bearing inside the bell housing.

    Jon B.
     
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