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Trying to identify a noise...

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by FinoCJ, Aug 31, 2015.

  1. Sep 4, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Sep 21, 2002
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    I guess no possibility of any engine to bell housing bolts back out due to aluminum threads then. Just wondering if someone could have been afraid to tighten some bolts because of the aluminum.
     
  2. Sep 8, 2015
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
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    Jul 18, 2013
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    Found some time to dig in a little further - ended up having to remove the transmission hump cover to inspect the top mounting bolts. Turns out two bolts on the driver side had fallen out - one was wedged between the top of the bellhousing and underside of the hump cover (can see the shavings where it was rubbing on the sheet metal) and the other is gone. Top bolt on the right was not finger loose, but not even close to torque spec. It also appears that some of the other bolts do not have lock washers - so to the hardware store tomorrow and see if I can get the pieces. Need to check FSM for bolts and torque specs. Any suggestions on the style of lock washer?

    [​IMG]

    cheers...
     
  3. Sep 9, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Best I can tell all of the bolts thread into the block, correct? My preference is split ring lock washers. I personally would go with a flat washer, lock washer, bolt. Also a bottom tap to clean out the threads and blow them out with air. Those threads need to not have any grit, chips, or whatever in there.

    Of course the original bolts might have a special grip head that doesn't require a lock washer.
     
  4. Sep 9, 2015
    PeteL

    PeteL If it wasn't for physics, and law enforcement... 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Hills of NH
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    Aug 3, 2003
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    Some racing "fastener" guys say a properly torqued bolt makes a lock washer redundant.
     
  5. Sep 9, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    A lock washer is somewhat redundant, but I'd rather have the backup than nothing. :) Without a lock washer a bolt (or nut) is basically either tight or loose. A split ring lock washer can help eliminate that issue with the force it applies.
     
  6. Sep 9, 2015
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Hope for the best, prepare for the worst

    Spokane Valley, WA
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    My dad and I had this debate a few weeks ago. Is the purpose of a split-ring lock washer to hold tension on the bolt, or to hold the bolt from spinning with its sharp edges?

    He made a comment about it holding tension on the bolt and I scoffed. The amount of pressure it can exert when compressed is minuscule in comparison to the torque that the bolt is applying if properly torqued.

    I was taught that a split ring lock washer should only be used on low-grade bolts, where it can dig in to the metals preventing it from backing out. I'd never heard of it keeping the bolt in place by "applying force" before.
     
  7. Sep 9, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    I've always gone with the logic that since a split ring wants to "not" be just flat the outward force (tension) it automatically applies not only keeps the nut or bolt tight but the tension also helps to keep the same from backing out even not quite as tight as necessary. I do know that I don't have stuff come loose when I tighten it with the proper fasteners. :) Also you could use the theory that lock washers were invented out of necessity and obviously are successful. ;)
     
  8. Sep 9, 2015
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Mar 4, 2003
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    Split ring lock washer on a faced bolt is what I normally use - Grade 8 hardware. If your concerned, use some med Locktight.
     
  9. Sep 9, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Yep, grade 8 all the way.
     
  10. Sep 9, 2015
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
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    Done no loctite. Tomorrow can put the cover hump back on. Might check anything else I can reach with a wrench such as tramission to adapter plate and adapter to bellhousing etc. The floor hump is enough of a nuisance to remove might as well check brake fluid and maybe flush if I can get some pedal help.

    Really hoping this is the extent of the problem. Looking forward to a few more trips with fall colors coming.
     
  11. Sep 9, 2015
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
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    You are both correct except on the low-grade bolt part. Lock washers and nuts are graded also according to the fasteners they are used with and manufactured accordingly. Most people are unaware of this or don't care.
     
  12. Sep 11, 2015
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
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    Update - got the bellhousing fully attached to the block and took for a quick errand. Everything seems to be good - the knocking noise is gone....so now I can hear the other noises that make wonder whats going to break next. Get it out and drive it around for while and see if everything holds.

    thanks!
     
  13. Sep 11, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Good thing you found it when you did! Glad it's fixed now. :)
     
  14. Sep 12, 2015
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    Drive, break, repair, repeat!
     
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