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New Engine Mounts, But V6 Is Still 1" Out Of Level

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by maurywhurt, May 14, 2018.

  1. May 14, 2018
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Western North...
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    My brother in law, Fred T, just replaced the engine mounts with new on his '67 V6 in an attempt to correct the lean of the engine toward one side. But to his surprise and mine, the new engine mounts didn't make any significant difference.

    If the engine mounts aren't the problem, what else could be causing the engine to lean over toward one side? Measuring from the tops of the valve covers, the distance to the top of the cowl is about 1" greater on the passenger side than on the driver's side.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
  2. May 14, 2018
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    Possibly the transfer case clocking or the transmission /transfer case insulators.
    Or a bent frame.
     
  3. May 14, 2018
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member Sponsor

    Northern California
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    Did this Jeep come from the factory with a V6 or was it transplanted after?............I would put the Jeep on a level piece of concrete and then start taking measurements from the ground up to the frame on both sides and then to the pan rail..............and keep moving up............and to the rear...............the difference will show up.

    Could be the physical steel motor mount hole is wallowed out on one side.........maybe welded in the wrong position........as mentioned above a bent or tweaked frame..........just need to get the tape out and crawl around it some.
     
    wheelie likes this.
  4. May 14, 2018
    Daryl

    Daryl Sponsor Sponsor

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    x2 om a tape measure. Level the frame and see what is off.
     
  5. May 14, 2018
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Western North...
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    The V6 is the original motor in his jeep. I'll post the results once he's measured the frame, etc. as suggested.

    Thanks for the input!
     
  6. May 14, 2018
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

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    Check to see if the body tub is sitting level on the frame. Your point of reference you are using is to the body (cowl) rather than the frame.
    -Donny
     
  7. May 14, 2018
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    Very good point....I'll let him know to also measure from the level floor to the tops of each fender opening so he can assess that.
     
  8. May 14, 2018
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member Sponsor

    Apopka, Fl
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    Can it be something so simple as the way the mounts are installed? As mentioned the transmission mount would have to be screwed up too. Is it noticeable in the tranmission shifter or the t-case shifter? I would think there would be a noticeable lean to them.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2018
  9. May 14, 2018
    wheelie

    wheelie beeg dummy Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    I believe there is a "left" and a "right" motor for the Dauntless. If switched, the result is as you describe. I'm going off of memory from long ago here. Someone please confirm this for me if I'm correct.
     
    Glenn likes this.
  10. May 14, 2018
    Walt Couch

    Walt Couch sidehill Cordele, Ga. Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    You are correct wheelie. The mounts are marked "L" and "R" and if switched it will cause the passenger side to be about 1 to 1-1/2" lower. I brought this to another members attention not long ago.
     
    Glenn likes this.
  11. May 14, 2018
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member Sponsor

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    Wheelies' and Walts' comments seem like that would be the answer.
     
  12. May 14, 2018
    Paulr26

    Paulr26 New Member

    Shelton, CT
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    Do you have the piece of wood that goes between the trans crossmember and the frame on the passenger side installed? That would bring the right side of the engine up if it isn't there.
     
  13. May 14, 2018
    wheelie

    wheelie beeg dummy Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    Thanks for the confirmation. If this is indeed the problem, it would mean that the mounts that were in it are also incorrectly installed replacements since the problem existed before Maury's BIL swapped in the newest mounts. In any case, I would check for the markings on the new mounts and make sure they are installed the right way. If the problem still exists after that, I would move on to the suggestions of others and level the JEEP up and begin measuring things. The body mounts could be tweaked or gone. The frame could be tweaked. Etc., etc., etc.
     
  14. May 19, 2018
    Fred T

    Fred T New Member

    Knoxville, TN
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    Thanks for your help with this guys. I hope to find some more time today to dig into this. I looked at the motor mounts and they sure seem to be installed correctly but I can't find where they are marked right and left. Kaiser Willys is closed today and the pictures on their website don't show how they are marked. The difference in shape is really subtle and hard to see when they are already installed.
    I do think perhaps the body is not mounted just right on the frame. I will try to post a few pictures.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
  15. Dec 1, 2019
    Fred T

    Fred T New Member

    Knoxville, TN
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    Well, I bought a new, very old house right after I posted the above and that was the end of Jeep time for awhile. I've got that under control so now I am back in action. My Dauntless engine is being rebuilt and now I have some good photos of my also out of level transmission. As you can see, where the engine mounts to the transmission is out of level too. I don't see a piece of wood anywhere. The engine mounts are gone with the engine, but I think they were right. I hope these picture links work...

    This is my transmission from the front with the engine out...

    [​IMG]


    Body mounted to frame:

    [​IMG]

    Transmission support mounted to frame passenger side
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Same as above - driver's side
    [​IMG]

    Transmission from front (obviously engine is out)

    Where transmission sits on support
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019 at 8:42 PM
  16. Dec 2, 2019 at 10:33 AM
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    As I mentioned to Fred, I'm wondering if maybe a taller transmission and/or transfer case than the original T-86 / D-18 was installed by the P.O. That could possibly explain the need to both lower the transmission crossmember and also raise the tub up off the frame slightly, as reflected in these photos.

    Can any of you tell from these photos whether or not the current transmission and transfer case is a T-86 & D-18?... and if it isn't, can the current one be identified from these photos?
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019 at 9:13 PM
  17. Dec 2, 2019 at 8:09 PM
    Fred T

    Fred T New Member

    Knoxville, TN
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    I've been in my garage measuring and the frame is pretty consistently level with my garage floor. However, the body is slightly lower on the passenger side. It is most obvious in the back, which I attribute to the spare tire being mounted to the side of the passenger side.
    If you look at the photo above from the front, the housing for the connection of the engine to the transmission is actually lower on the passenger side meaning my body lean to the passenger side is actually making this look better then it would if the body were actually level.
    The two top bolt holes in the housing, which look like they ought to be level are actually a half inch different... The passenger side being lower.
     
  18. Dec 2, 2019 at 9:58 PM
    Twin2

    Twin2 wasn't me Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    the problem with pictures with engine out is
    the weight of transfer case will rock everything to passenger side
     
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  19. Dec 2, 2019 at 10:28 PM
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    Any ideas as to why Fred's transmission crossmember would have inch +/- deep spacers where it mounts to the frame?:

    [​IMG]


    For comparison, here's mine:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019 at 10:44 PM
  20. Dec 2, 2019 at 10:52 PM
    Fred T

    Fred T New Member

    Knoxville, TN
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    That may explain why it seems so extreme now without the engine. Thx.
     

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