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Fino's 58 Wagon

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by FinoCJ, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. Aug 14, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Jul 18, 2013
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    2,405
    Question...looking at mechanical fuel pumps for the sbc...there are a lot of options across a huge price range:
    https://www.summitracing.com/search...l-283?SortBy=DisplayPrice&SortOrder=Ascending

    It appears to me the main differences are with regard to the 2 or 3 ports (with or without return line...fwiw there is no fuel return line set-up on the wagon), the orientation of the ports - some provide multiple options it appears - as well as threaded flare fittings vs rubber hose clamp style etc. I don't see any reason to break the bank on this and there is lots of room in engine bay to make just about any fuel line routing work. I would normally consider a simple Carter or Delco brand, but think these days just about all these cheap pumps are from overseas, and probably are essentially identical...any suggestions/recommendations?
     
  2. Aug 14, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    2nd question: Thinking about the cooling system...It had the ridiculous shroud on it, as well as a poorly done overflow coolant tank. As you can see in post 32, I need to figure out the radiator-fan spacing etc. It seems to me the stock L6 radiator is probably too small to cool the sbc (using engine displacement +50 as rough approximation for core area) - especially with the fan spacing.

    a) Is there a good common radiator swap for a sbc that will fit reasonably well in the mounting area (with some bracket fabrication of course)?

    b) How to best address the large radiator to fan spacing? Will a well designed shroud do the trick? Can move the radiator back just a bit with bracket fabrication - but that comes at some cost of air flow in from the grill. Remove the mechanical fan use a radiator with an integrated pulling electric fan and shroud? Moving the engine forward probably isn't an option at this point...?
     
  3. Aug 14, 2019
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2019 Sponsor

    Cottonwood, Ca
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    FinoCJ likes this.
  4. Aug 14, 2019
    Jw60

    Jw60 Recovering Jeepaholic

    Sedalia MO.
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    Oct 5, 2018
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    304
    Does the wagon have electric or vacuum windshield wipers?
    Here's a pic of what I'm using.
    [​IMG]1126121652 by Joe with a jeep, on Flickr
     
  5. Aug 14, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Was looking at that one as well...Was worried about the smallish size of the core, but 450hp is way more than I would have...$214 (+$30 for shipping) seems pretty good, and ideally it will mount right up. think its the same one KW has for 399 (free shipping).

    Would still have to figure out the large fan spacing and shroud...there seems like there should be fan spacers that I could bolt on behind the fan to move it closer to the radiator?

    edit - found them: https://www.summitracing.com/search...nding&tw=fan spacer&sw=Mechanical Fan Spacers
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2019
  6. Aug 14, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Quadrajet disassembled....(and a fuel pump sitting off to the side)...there was no inline fuel filter either before the pump, or between the pump and carb inlet. There was the inlet filter on the carb at least...time to clean more...fwiw the carb number is 7029200 which looks to go with a '69 427. The main jets are 71, main metering rods are 49B, and secondary metering rods are BC. I feel like 71 is standard size, and maybe I should look to downsize to 69 given the high elevation here in Colo. Not sure if I should change the metering rods in any way?
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2019
  7. Aug 14, 2019
    Dave Deyton

    Dave Deyton Member

    Fuquay-Varina, NC
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    Oct 12, 2003
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    This looks to be a really great project.
    I need to get to your part of the country to find a nice running vintage CJ.
    You have a lot of nice vintage Jeeps out there.
    These around here are rust buckets.

    Dave
     
  8. Aug 14, 2019
    jeep peep69

    jeep peep69 Sponsor Sponsor

    redding ca.
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    Dec 8, 2007
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    They make spacers for the engine fan that goes between the water pump and fan in various lengths up to 3 inches. That may get the fan closer.
     
  9. Aug 15, 2019
    45es

    45es Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
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    I gotta ask. If this new radiator that is the same size as the one you have, is capable of cooling an engine of more than double the horse power of the 283 and there is nothing visibly wrong with the one in the Jeep now, why replace it? Save your money and buy or build a shroud.
     
  10. Aug 17, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Here are the steel rims that I got with the wagon...they appear to be 16x5 or so...not sure if they would have been original to the wagon or not, but I think I would like to use them instead of the white wagon rims, although that is a long way off at this point.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2019
  11. Aug 17, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member Sponsor

    Falcon, CO
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    If I remember right - the 16s were stock on the PU and Wagons of that time.
     
  12. Aug 17, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Here is the spare...it seems to be a matching rim (probably the oem white/cream color). Still has an untouched suburbanite tire on it....
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Twin2 likes this.
  13. Aug 17, 2019
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member Sponsor

    Apopka, Fl
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    For the width you measure bead to bead=inside mounting surface to inside mounting surface.
     
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  14. Aug 17, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    So these are the well plugs, and cannot tell if anything has been done to seal them up - they are a bit discolored, but that might just be from the leaking fuel. Any specific or helpful hint to sealing these up - I already have some JB weld that won't degrade with fuel.

    [​IMG]

    Second q-jet question....I was a bit surprised to find no inline filter between the pump and carb....there is the carb inlet filter. Doing a little research, Lars Grimsrud who is a local Colo corvette guy and rebuilds lots of q-jets, suggests this is correct. An inline filter before the carb and the carb inlet filter will often cause fuel starvation in a Qjet at WOT. OF course, I am probably not running the same fuel needs as some of the corvette guys, but does this seem correct? I don't know Lars very well, but he is a bit of a Colo legend (hopefully for the right reasons).
     
  15. Aug 18, 2019
    45es

    45es Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
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    James, look at this web site. There is quite a bit of information about the original 1958 Jeep wagon. There is also data for the original tire size as well as optional size.

    https://www.automobile-catalog.com/make/jeep/station_wagon_willys/station_wagon_willys/1958.html
     
  16. Aug 18, 2019
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    At the foot of...
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    Yep, just cover those well plugs with JB Weld. Don't bother to use that little black spongy thing that comes with the carb kit.
    As far as the fuel filter, every Qjet I've ever seen had one in the carb inlet. I don't see any reason not to use it.
     
  17. Aug 18, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    was thinking more about not using an inline filter right after the pump. For the cj with the r2g, it has both an inline and carb inlet filter. Am a bit nervous leaving out the inline filter.
     
  18. Aug 19, 2019
    masscj2a

    masscj2a Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Chester Mass
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    James just got caught up on this. Nice wagon you have there. I use to run Q-jets on my early sbc cars. They are easy on fuel until you light up the secondaries. Sound awesome though when you do. A nice truck avenger would also be a good choice. Someday a wagon is on the menu.
     
    FinoCJ likes this.
  19. Aug 19, 2019
    Long&Low

    Long&Low Active Member

    Geauga County, OH
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    I love that interior.
     
  20. Aug 20, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Hopefully finishing up work on the fuel supply so I can try driving it around a bit more and see how other stuff works. Got the fuel pump in...its kind of a PITA given where the pump is located on the front of the block and the front motor mount adapter pieces make hand access difficult. And I am sure some of you are well acquainted with the sbc fuel pump pin that pumps the fuel pump arm - as it seems to fall down and block installation no matter what! As its been over 100 in my garage recently, vasoline just won't hold it up, and there isn't enough room with the motor mounts, my hand and a screwdriver to get everything together and get the bolts started.
    [​IMG]
    Also doesn't help that the simple pumps seem to all have the fuel line ports on the front of the pump, and all the line come and go from the back. If doing this again, I would probably invest in a more expensive pump with better options for fuel line connection location. But a little time bending some new steel line and getting rid of POs complicated and leaking system wasn't too bad. I also learned that the fuel pump area is apparently lower the the fuel tank so every time I had to test fit or adjust the feed line, I got fuel spilled all over me - tired of my hair (and garage) smelling like gasoline for the last 3 days.

    Carb is almost finalized...finished up the rebuild late last night so need to double check...I sealed up the fuel bowl wells using the slow setting Marine grade JB Weld as its specifically states good for petroleum and fuel. I couldn't make it look it all pretty - but so long as it works.
    [​IMG]

    In case anyone is interested in Qjet rebuild videos - I thought this Harold Demes set was very good. I didn't do full rebuild of the baseplate and throttle and choke plate shafts, nor did I replate everything to make it look pretty, but goes to show the quality and attention to detail of the builder - also looks to have some videos of other Holley etc carbs:
    part 1:
    part 2:
    part 3:
     
    ojgrsoi likes this.
  21. Aug 20, 2019
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
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    Quick carb question...when I pulled the carb off, there were two gaskets under the base plate: a typical paper type gasket and a metal foil one. The metal foil I believe was under the paper gasket and sat directly on top of the intake manifold...looks like its main purpose is to block the preheater area off. I think a lot of people block these off. I don't think I care one way or the other, I just want to make sure it will seal against the intake manifold.

    [​IMG]
     

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