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build your own full float dana 44?

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by 47v6, Jan 6, 2015.

  1. Jun 22, 2015
    47v6

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    Washington DC.
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    This is my rear axle assembly. Speed bleeders point up and the calipers are on the rearward facing side of the axle assembly. If you look at the driveshaft you will see the drum parking brake on the back of the d18 transfer case. I kind of don't understand your question I think.

    On another note I set a dial indicator on this same side and got .015 runout. Found my pulsating pedal. recut the rotor/hub assembly and its all good now. Brakes work great now. I didn't realize how noisy my old tapered d44 was until I swapped this one in. Clunking, vibration, friction too. I am stoked!
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2015
  2. Jun 23, 2015
    Mike C

    Mike C Member

    Austin, TX
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    Nice work!
     
  3. Jun 23, 2015
    47v6

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    Re: Full float going in today

    Just drove my jeep 20 miles to Bethesda from D.C. in city stop and go driving to get a haircut and back. Its 92 degrees out. Didn't blow up anything. New differential feels about 140 degrees to the calibrated touch.

    On another note I do have quite the pulsating brake pedal, not not all the time. I put a dial indicator on my rear rotors while installed on my jeep and after i turned the right rear side that was .015 out i now have .001 on both sides of the right rear. the left rear I get .005 on one side out. I will be putting all 4 corners up on jack stands and testing runout to figure this out. I never did turn the front rotors after the conversion and maybe I had enough play in the old rear setup to not allow pulsation to be felt at the pedal itself. Pulsation or not, the brakes are way better. Jeep seems to handle better too, but I bet thats psychosomatic because of the lack of sale shafts clanking around in the housing.:shock:
     
  4. Jun 24, 2015
    47v6

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    Re: Full float going in today

    Found the pulsating brake pedal culprit. Front left rotor is .050 out. disassembled the hub/rotor assembly, cut the hub where the rotor contacts it and realized the hub is no good. the race spins by hand in the hub. Good thing I have a junk pile to pull a hub off a d27.
     
  5. Jun 25, 2015
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
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    Re: Full float going in today

    Just as an fyi .005" is the rule-of-thumb limit for rotor runout...
     
  6. Jun 25, 2015
    47v6

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    Re: Full float going in today

    Thank you Nick. I was wondering what the tolerance was. i figured it would be about that. .050 is a lot of runout. I pulled the one side off a junked d27 and its got a welded lug stud. the other side does not. The bearings are garbage and the inside of those hubs are filled with a greasy sand like mess of rust and ick. Maybe I can salvage one of them.
     
  7. Jun 25, 2015
    47v6

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    Re: Full float going in today

    Seems that the lug studs look at if they are mushroomed on the outside of the hub on the side facing the threads. i can only assume this is "swedged" and would have made it very difficult to remove the drum initially and wallowed out the hub if i had tried to press out the studs as is. I decided to use an angle grinder and cut them flush with the face of the hub and then turn them flush on my lathe, then press them out.

    I turned the hub where it will now mate to the rotor. it was out quite a bit. I then assembled the hub/rotor assembly with the pressed in lug studs and re cut the rotor/hub assembly. It was only .010 out as compared to the d25 hub/rotor assembly that was .050 out, hence the brake pedal pulsation.

    I have none of the LM type bearings, only the narrower D25 type so i decided to take a chance and go to auto zone. I can be sure 75% of the they will not have what i want. Its close though. I went with the bearing and cup of course. I set the bearing set on the counter and stated that i wanted these. He asked me the year make and model, so i used 1965 cj5. Thought that would get me close. his part is something called "set 45". he never looked at the part i needed to replace. He goes and gets a box that is obviously wrong. I pull out the bearing at it is at least 15% larger than what I have. It is also "china" brand bearings.

    I state that this is incorrect for my application. This is the part i need, as i show him the numbers on the bearing and cone. "Oh you have part numbers", he says. I say "before you even look, do you have a brand name bearing like koyo or timken or SKF or something similar?" He points to the china name on the bearing and says this is what we have in another store. I said nope, i will just buy it at another place. Thanks, bye.

    But wait, theres more...

    As I am leaving a guy is helping another customer. I walk past and i hear, Hello, Hello ,HEEELLOOOOO!!!!!!! SIR! i realize its the guy who was helping the other guy and he's yelling hello very rudely at me. I guess i better turn around because i either dropped something or he's about to have the cop who is hired to sit there every evening arrest me. So I turn around and he asks me if he can help me like I insulted him. He then proceeds to tell me he's trying to help me and I should answer him. I state calmly that I do not want help from him because he is rude. Rude ? Rude because I am trying help you? he says. I guess he thinks that I should be giving him my undivided attention since I am in his store. he is special and requires that i pay attention to him... I then tell him that there is no way I am going to buy anything from him and walk out. I am pretty sure he was immediately mad enough to chase me outside and fight me.

    All this because of wheel bearings.

    I solved my problem ,and his, by ordering genuine Timken cone and cup on Amazon for half price of the "china" brand ones they were trying to sell me. they will be here Saturday guaranteed. They still might be made in China, but at least auto zone won't get my money.

    Always excitement here. Thanks for reading.
     
  8. Jun 30, 2015
    47v6

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    Re: Full float going in today

    Still fighting the pulsating pedal. I am very stubborn and when things don't work according to plan I try my very best to figure out the problem. As i chucked up the hub/rotor assembly there is something that is out of tolerance and allowing runout on the cut. To get away from that i made a mandrel that i indicated in. The outside is the same diameter as my spindle. I then tried to cut threads to just screw on the spindle nut really tight and lock up the bearings. My skills aren't there yet as this was the first time I tried to cut threads. I ended up drilling and tapping the end of the mandrel to accept a 9/16 bolt and using an old bearing race and a thick washer can apply enough preload on the bearings to cut the rotor.
    [​IMG]

    this allows the hub/rotor assembly to ride as it would on the spindle and give me a more accurate cut. Basically I made a brake lathe. It works ok. In order for me to cut both sides I have to remove the hub/ rotor assembly and somehow this changes tolerance a couple thousandths. I should have just taken this to a place that cuts rotors, right? I said I was stubborn.

    I got rid of 99% of any pulsation at the pedal, but there is at least one rotor that is slightly thicker or has a bit to much runout because when applying the brakes I can feel the brake effectiveness increase just a bit more depending on where the tire is on its revolution.

    Regardless, my brakes are as good as i would expect this setup to be and i am very happy. I can almost lock up the 35x12.50 tires on pavement at 35mph with manual disk brakes now.
     
  9. Jul 1, 2015
    millennium falcon

    millennium falcon Member

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    Well....I'm glad you got you brake issues figured out! and as far as the autozone story........haha I wish I had been there. I go through the same thing all the time at my local advanced auto. Those guys are so ignorant and rude. I even have my 3 year old daughter trained to tell me "don't go in there dad" My parents were watching my son (6 years old) the other day and they drove by the parts store and he told my dad..."those guys don't know anything" haha! that made my day!
     
  10. Jul 10, 2015
    47v6

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    seems like its par for the course to have the locking hub bolts loosen after a while. Today i checked and and they were ALL very loose. I will soon be installing studs with permanent locktite. I do not know why this is an issue, but seems to be a normal problem that others have encountered.
     
  11. Jul 10, 2015
    millennium falcon

    millennium falcon Member

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    Yes my warn hubs loosen up all the time until I put locktite on them.
     
  12. Jul 10, 2015
    47v6

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    my old front ones do not though. Just the rear and quite a lot fairly quickly. seems that happens to the full float conversion enough that some guys just run drive flanges.
     
  13. Jul 10, 2015
    millennium falcon

    millennium falcon Member

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    I also switched over to star washers....that seemed to help some as well.
     
  14. Jul 12, 2015
    47v6

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  15. Jul 13, 2015
    47v6

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    No studs at fastenal so i just bought some grade 5 full thread bolts. I don't need grade 8 i don't think. I locktited them with the high strength stuff real good. I bought a bag of the pinch style lock nuts too.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    this thread is never ending huh?
     
  16. Jul 13, 2015
    Focker

    Focker That's what I do, I know things and I fix stuff. Staff Member 2019 Sponsor

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    Loctite243?
     
  17. Jul 13, 2015
    47v6

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    high strength loctite 271. says needs to be heated to 500 degrees to separate. I thoroughly cleaned the threads with a tap and carb cleaner and blew out the holes. If these come loose or just plain break I have a bent housing or another issue I have overlooked or machined incorrectly. Time will tell.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2015
  18. Jul 13, 2015
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

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    I had the same loosening issue on front and rear hubs until I went with the studs and lock nuts. Every once in a while a nut will work loose, but it pretty much has solved most of the issue. I simply go around with a wrench periodically and check them, while I'm checking lug nuts also.
     
  19. Jul 15, 2015
    47v6

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    Installed the machined D30 Disk spindles, disk hubs and new disks. I had brake pulsation and I am sure it was because I had machined something incorrectly. I also think this is related to my locking hubs loosening.
    [​IMG]

    The brake pulsation is gone and the effective braking is fantastic, almost power like.
     
  20. Aug 11, 2018
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Member 2020 Sponsor

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    Hey Chris you remember meeting my daughter in D.C. a few months ago? She runs the lathe and mills in her robotics program in High School. We just went through this thread and she was shocked at the results you got with that lathe. She may have laughed a lot also but she was impressed (y)
     
    47v6 likes this.

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