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left front axle not engaging

Discussion in 'Intermediate CJ-5/6/7/8' started by yelocj5r, Jun 20, 2010.

  1. Jun 20, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    Ok, I have a dana 30 front end, (detroit locker). when engage 4wheel drive
    the left side axle is not locking or engaging.:shock:Manual hub is engaged.(warn) Right front
    is working ok in 4x4. I did hear a little bit of clicking noise on a turn, but nothing
    that would have told me something had gone wrong. I've tried to locate some
    info through search, but have been unable....can ya come up with some info...:cry::hurrican::coffee:everything I have read is relating to a vacuum
    system of which I don't even think I have that. MY vehicle is a 74 cj5.;)... tks for any help...tom
     
  2. Jun 20, 2010
    nwedgar

    nwedgar Now with TBI!

    Newnan, Georgia
    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2005
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    1,785
    Your hub might be busted on that side. You could jack up the front of the Jeep, engage the hub in 4x4 and put it in 4Lo or Hi. If you can manually turn the left tire and nothing else moves its probably the hub. Pretty easy to take off and check...or replace.
     
  3. Jul 3, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
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    14
    ok I finally found time to take left front hub off, this is after I checked
    the front left axle by engaging 4x4 and putting transfer case into 4 low.
    the left front wheel will turn. tried the right front wheel and it locks in.
    Now I take off the left front hub and cover and all looks pretty dang good.
    nothing broken to me eyes....So now we come to the part that
    I am not getting. I looked up to find the size of the axle nut, and
    what ever,is behind that and all indications is that it is a 36 mm....(what?).
    I measured across with a tape measure(don't have calipers. I get about
    2 and 3/16 maybe 2 and 1/8 inches edge to edge on the 5 sided nut...
    I think maybe I am at stand still to where and what size axle nut socket
    I will need. and it better be deep.....What do ya think out there...(its a dana
    30 with 27 spline axle...Has detroit locker)Come on back gents need help...tks
     
  4. Jul 3, 2010
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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  5. Jul 3, 2010
    jpflat2a

    jpflat2a what's that noise?

    Riverside CA
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    Jul 30, 2003
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    no need to pull the wheel hub and or wheel bearings, unless you just want to.
    the problem is going to be with the locking hub, if you can see the axle turning in 4WD.
    what type of locking hubs ?
    take the over side off and compare the two side by side to notice any differences
     
  6. Jul 3, 2010
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
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    12,119
    "correct" size is 2 3/32" but usually a 2 1/8" will work.
    With the locking hub off of the vehicle, put it back together with the small screws that hold the hub together. Dial it to the "lock" position then see if the gear is locked to the hub body (the splined part on the back of the hub). If not, then the hub is not locking in. Also make sure it unlocks as well and the gear moves freely.

    If the hub is ok, further disassembly is needed. I'd suspect the axle shaft being broken before the Detroit locker. It's somewhat common for them to break in the splined area or just outboard of the seal area. If the axle shaft comes out in one piece and the hub is ok, then it sounds like a problem with the locker.
     
  7. Jul 4, 2010
    bkd

    bkd Moderator Supreme Staff Member

    K-Town Tenn.
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    Apr 29, 2007
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    3,292
    Tom I have the socket and a good lockout if you want to come over we can check it here
    Jim
     
  8. Jul 6, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    sorry guys been out of town for the 4th and now back. I took the hub off, and ckd
    all contacting areas and all seem good. I didn't have the spindle nut socket so I had
    to order. will be here later this week. I have taken in all your suggestions, and will remove the nut and see whats going on inside. I have been told there is another
    spring on the back side of that area that is part of the warn hub and it could be
    broken. Is this a possibility. I also see that there is a big lack of grease in the area
    and pretty much need to do some maintenance on the bearings while there. can this
    all be done without having to take the brake disc assembly off. I sure hope so...hey jim tanks for the offer but I am up north with the jeep and will have to work on it
    here....come back again guys....tks.....
     
  9. Jul 6, 2010
    DrDanteIII

    DrDanteIII Master Procrastinator 2021 Sponsor

    Milford NJ 08848
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    Any bearing service is going to require that you take the wheel hub and disk off

    Dont forget to take the snap ring off of the end of the axel shaft before trying to remove the hub.
     
  10. Jul 6, 2010
    jpflat2a

    jpflat2a what's that noise?

    Riverside CA
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    Jul 30, 2003
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    :?
    if you've taken the complete locking hub off of the wheel hub, you won't find anything else you're describing.
     
  11. Jul 7, 2010
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
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    12,119
    Can you take pics of where you are at? At this point I agree with Jpflat2a. Once the hub body is off that's it. After that is the wheel bearing nuts/retainers which hold on the bearing hub/rotor/drum assembly. If you plan on re-packing/inspecting the bearings you will need an inner wheel bearing grease seal as well. Drum brakes use a National # 8430s and iirc disc brakes use a CR # 23300 seal or equivalent but don't take that as gospel.
     
  12. Jul 20, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    Ok big updates to the left axle operation. I finally got the correct socket
    of which is a 2 and 1/16 inch. If you try even a 2 and 3/32 IT Will not work...
    So I got the nuts off and pulled the rotor and removed the axle. Well to my
    dismay there was nothing wrong with the splined end all looks great. there is a
    shinney part on the shaft about 4 inches from the splined diff. end. has some what of a grove in it.:rofl:. don't know where that came from, so Now I take
    the diff cover off and drain. find alot of broken metal pieces inside at bottom
    of diff. look very closely and find ring gear and pinion gears look great.Now to
    the part that really P........sses me off.....I had a detroit locker installed in
    this dana 30 and as far as off road miiles with it installed and engaged, I
    might have 250 miles...if all of that. Well with closer inspection of the locker
    housing bolts I have 3 of the allen head bolts backed out about 1 1/2 turns, I have metall marks on the outer housing of the locker from the ring gear hitting
    and I am truly in an up roar. I don't feel if properly torqued they should ever
    back out from that position....:mad::beer:is this an over sight from the
    installer.....????Help me out guys, my guess is that spider gears are junk
    and possilbly the whole detroit locker....(guess what I need to find) or
    what I need to obtain... I think I'll go back to no locker in front and just replace the one axle on left. :(who's got some help with that....tks for reading......
     
  13. Jul 21, 2010
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
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    12,119
    Was the Detroit Locker a full case locker and was it purchased new? If so, they come from the factory torqued and has nothing to do with the installer. If the ring gear bolts backed off that would be a different deal. Sounds like it needs to be disassembled to ascertain damage. If bought used and supplied by you, still not the installer's issue. If supplied by him and it was used, maybe a different deal.

    Why wouldn't the 2 3/32" socket work? Have one in my tool box I've been using on Jeeps and IH Scouts for 15 plus years...
     
  14. Jul 21, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
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    14
    Ok got the pics and will try to get some set up on this thread soon
    I have looked alittle closer to what is in the pumkin and what I see on
    the pics. I have been going with the fact that the full locker is damaged
    and would be the culpert. well I am thinking different now. The groves in the
    locker housing are from the pinion gear, and that means it must not have been
    set properly when locker put in, I'm not the expert, but it seems to be leading
    to that fact. it is set so far off that it has actually put marks on the bolt
    heads that secure the locker together, meaning the allen head bolts. I'll get
    the pics up and you can see and give me your opinion....tks for reading and
    hear from you soon....
     
  15. Jul 22, 2010
    80cj

    80cj Member

    Hawaii
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  16. Jul 27, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
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    14
    After complete removal of left axle found inner axle spline to be in
    great shape not and damage to them. So I remove the pumpkin cover and
    now find some still unrecognizable damage. There are pinion gear marks around half of the detroit locker housing, I find 3 of the 8 allen head bolts loose
    in the locker housing all showing damage marks on the screws..I find a palm
    full of broken metal pieces in the pumpkin bottom..Am I not to happy right
    now.bkd can you post those pics I sent to you for me, these guys might want
    to see....What I'd like to do is get the locker removed, go back to just having
    the dana 30 work and it would without locker in it. Or do I try to acquire a
    pick a part dana 30 with 27 spline axles and 4:11 or as I was told from
    the guy I bought it from that it had 4:27....I'm not good at this tech
    stuff as you can probably tell...:rofl::?
     
  17. Jul 27, 2010
    bkd

    bkd Moderator Supreme Staff Member

    K-Town Tenn.
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    Apr 29, 2007
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    what did they say where you had the Detroit installed???????
    I'll try to get to the pics later, hands a little full with my rig right now
    Jim
     
  18. Jul 27, 2010
    bkd

    bkd Moderator Supreme Staff Member

    K-Town Tenn.
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2007
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    3,292
    here's your pics Tom
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  19. Jul 27, 2010
    yelocj5r

    yelocj5r now that is yellow it doe

    lompoc ca
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    Ok here are some pics that were put in (thank you bkd) and if some of
    you guys take a look, I'm hoping you will see what I do and possibly agree
    that I think that the pinion gear was the cause of the bolts backing off
    from even seeing the metal marks on the bolts as well as the housing. Kinda
    makes an issue with me why the install shop doesn't feel responsible to a
    point.....tks for reading and looking at pics.....:beer::rofl:
     
  20. Jul 27, 2010
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
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    12,119
    From the pics it looks like the drive pinion gear has been moving and hitting the diff case and bolt heads which could cause the bolts to loosen up. I'd talk to the shop and show them the pics. If they aren't willing to at least check it out I'd find someone else to do my work. The ring gear looks like there is damage on the toe area (inside of the teeth) as well. Sometimes things go bad, may or may not be the shops fault, but they should be willing to look at it free of charge. At least I would, but I'm picky about my reputation....
     
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