cj5 front/rear axle recommendation

Greetings. I like some help on recommendations for new axles for my '67 CJ5. Here's the situation. I purchased this last year from the previous owner who had extensive modifications to the jeep for off-roading. Here's the major mods: Spring Over Axle, Body lift, shackle reversal, ladder/traction bar added, chevy small block 305 engine, 35" tires. The current axles are the stock Dana 44 in rear and Dana 27 in front. The problem is that the lift is just a little too high for my tastes. The axles need to be wider. I'd rather change the axles than to go back an lower the suspension or body lift (either on of these would require more modifications). So, I'm considering changing out the front and rear axles to something stronger and wider. The rear differential is centered and the front is offset to the passenger's side. What donor vehicle(s) would you recommend to "transplant" over to my CJ5 that will result in a minimum of fabrication? At a minimum, I'd like to have Dana 44s front and rear, but something bigger/stronger would be OK too. Is it possible to purchase new axles? If so, who would you recommend? I appreciate any thoughts.

Regards,

Jim

 

Re: cj5 front/read axle recommendation

Well, any axle you swap in is going to be the same amount of work unless you go with a later Cj axle. A D30 front and keeep the same rear you already have.

Any other axles and you will need to outboard the front springs. You can go with a D44 or a D60 for the same amount of work. ONly real difference will be the initial cost of the axle. A D44 can be found for a couple hundred. A front D60 will run you a grand or more.

Same for the rear. You have a narrow frame. If you were to get full width axles, you really need to outboard the rear springs. SOme pleopl will say you can just weld on axle perches and bolt them up but if you tink of the physics of it, the wider you can get the perches on the rear axle, the more stable it is. again, you can upgrade from the D44 to a D60 or a 14 bolt for the same amoutn of work. Each axle has it's pros and cons.

 

Re: cj5 front/read axle recommendation

If you want a Dana 44 front, and are willing to outboard the springs, a '74-79 Wagoneer axle will work well. It will have 6-lug hubs (6 on 5.5" circle), which is only a problem if you have wheels that you want to keep.

The rear from the same years of Wagoneer will also be a D44, but most were automatic cars, and almost all of those used the BW13xx Quadratrac transfer case. This made the rear axle pumpkin offset (too much?) for a CJ. The manual cars and a few '74s used the Dana 20 TC, and that axles was offset a little, and might work ok, depending on your rear driveshaft length and which transfer case you have.

The '80-89 Wagoneer used the M23 AMC Corporate axle, which in the Wagoneer is comparable to the Dana 44. Different from the M20 used in the CJ, it has 1-piece axles and stronger axle tubes.

Most Wagoneer axles will have highway gear ratios like 3.54 or3.31 ('70s), or 3.31 or 2.73 ('80s) which you would likely want to replace. Optional 4.10s were available in the '70s with the 258 and manual trans, but these are scarce.

The really heavy axles like the Dana 60 and GM 14-bolt were mostly used in the rear of high-GVWR pickups and vans and will need to be narrowed. Expensive, but maybe something you would want if your budget allows it.

 

Re: cj5 front/read axle recommendation

Thanks for the info. Can someone give me more detail on what you are calling "outboard the front springs"? Does this mean I actually move them wider apart or further forward? If it's wider, how do you do that since they mount to the frame? If forward, do you cut off the spring mounts and weld new ones further forward? Thanks.

Jim

 

Re: cj5 front/read axle recommendation

wider apart they would mount to the outside of the frame instead of under it

 

Re: cj5 front/read axle recommendation

Google "CJ spring outboard" or "'full width axles on a CJ" and you will get lots of information.

But basically it's just as sterlclan said. The spring pads on the axle are actually wider than the frame rails. SO when you try to mount, the points where the shackle and the spring mounts to the frame is too wide. You need to either rebuild the mounting points on the frame or you by a kit from some place like Blue Torch Fabworks or M.O.R.E. and weld it on.

IN the world of fabrication, I'd say it's kinda on a beginner/intermediate level. You got to know how to weld or take it to someone that can weld.

It is a real big undertaking to get a fullwidth axle under a CJ.

The other option is a Tim suggested, get the axle cut down to fit the CJ. But from your first post and description, I thought you wanted to widen the stance of the CJ. Only way to do that is to outboard the springs and put wider axles on it.

 

You might think about some toyota axles.

 

why do you needwider axles? do the tires rub?

 

I wanted wider axles because of the lift put on by the previous owner. It currently has a SOA as well as a body lift, along with 35 inch tires. I know I have other options, like going back to a SUA suspension or removing the body lift, but I wanted to understand what is involved with going to wider axles. I was hoping that there is a set of axles from another vehicle that would more easily bolt in to the CJ5, that is with a minimum amount of fabrication. By the way, I can't just lower or remove the lift because the previous owner modified some components which takes advantage of the the space between the frame and the body. I would have to modify these items to fit again. Not impossible, just more work.

 

Running 35's and a V8, the stock axles won't last if you wheel it. Waggy axles are a cost effective upgrade if your moderately handy and they are abut 10" wider than stock.

 

Can you give me some more info on the suggested "waggy" axles? What year(s)? What do I have to do to get them to work? Thanks.

Jim

 

See Timgr's post above.

 

I have also heard about using scout axles has anyone tried that route? Thanks

 

Scout axles are do-able but have some inherent issues like not enough caster built in and the too long steering arms on the knuckles. Do a search on this. It's been covered quite a bit. The Scout 2 rear is easy, just move the spring pads. The width is right around 58 1/2" wide wms to wms.

 

Thanks for all of the info guys. I'll check out the Scout axles.

 

Uhhh, did you read all the posts? The Scout 2 rear is ok but the Scout 2 front has problems when used in this conversion. See Timgr's post about the Wagoneer (Waggy) front axle. A much better axle to use in the front. You can use the Waggy rear also for this conversion with no more problems than the Scout 2 and parts like brake drums are much more available. If you really want the 5 lug CJ pattern then the Scout 2 rear with the Waggy front with a 5 lug conversion using Ford hub and rotors is very do-able. The Waggy front doesn't suffer from the issues the Scout 2 does. Do a search on this. Covered extensively.

 

Yes, I need to go back an read all of the comments. The problem is that they come over several days, so I tend to forget the earlier ones. It looks like I should look for some waggy axles first. I still haven't decided to do this yet, but I think I should keep my eye out for some axles and go from there. Thanks.