Confusion about aftermarket axles

I am interested in beefing up the axles on my CJ-6, and am all for overbuilding for my needs. so I've been researching the options....everything from swaps to aftermarket axles. My question surrounds the aftermarket axles.

Questions:

1) Knuckles: I've read articles and what not regarding aftermarket axles and I hear this comment over and over again "Currie (for example, but they say it about others as well) front ends are ok, but they still have Dana 30 knuckles. What good is the 9" and beefier axles if I am still stuck with Dana 30 knuckles."

What the heck does this mean? I can read, so I understand what Dana 30 knuckle means, but why does the aftermarket axle have to use them? If you're buying a front end from WMS to WMS, why can't you just spec it out however you want?

2) Currie HP front end - It's been said many times that high pinion front ends are stronger than low pinion front ends due to driving on the drive side rather than the coast side of the gears. Is the CHP front end true to this statement, or is it a different animal all on its own?

3) Currie front end vs. D44 - If I'm going aftermarket, is the 9" that much stronger? What are the advantages over the aftermarket D44?

I haven't decided on aftermarket axles, just doing my research!

Thanks!

 

First question to answer. What do you plan on doing with this CJ-6? hard core crawling, Overland expedition, weekend trail riding... etc..

After you ask your self that question then start looking for upgrades. A lot of the Currie front end replacements are built so that the end user can use their brakes, hubs, knuckles to save cash. You you can order a WMS-WMS front axle from them with all the goodies to your exeact specs. But its not cheap.

Upgrade the shafts to chomolly in a Dana 30 and the ring and pinion becomes your week point. Replace the center to the knuckles with a 9 inch, use chromolly outters and you have a pretty strong set up.

I run a WT Dana 30 front. I have broken 1 inner and 3 outter axles in 5 years. I have never had a problem with the ring and pinion. Since I have upgraded to Chromolly I have only broken 1 outter and that was stupidity on my part. I have put my Jeep on some pretty serious stuff in that 5 years.

 

Good question Hudson! I should have started off with that info.

My plans for this Jeep are everything you mentioned with the exception of hardcore rock crawling. I do want it to be capable of moderate rock crawling though. I plan on using it a lot for hunting, and I don't want to have to worry about carrying too much in the way of spare parts. U-joints, hubs are fine, but spare axle shafts, etc. start to take up a lot of space, and although the CJ-6 is bigger than a CJ-5, there still isn't an abundance of room, and hunting gear takes up a lot of space, not to mention having to carry people, and hopefully downed game. I know hunting isn't hard core crawling, but hunting is only part of it, and believe it or not, we do encounter some heavy stuff while out hunting - every break down we've had while out in the 4x4's (u joints, yokes, tires, etc.) have been on hunting trips, while our trail rides have been trouble free!

I also want something that will be reliable behind a 360 and 35" tires. Basically, I am taking the "crane certification" approach. Here at work we test cranes to 125% of their capacity as one of the steps in certifying them. I want the peace of mind knowing that I can worry about enjoying the outing, and not the reliability of my vehicle, especially when I'm alone in the middle of nowhere. At the same time, I don't to go overboard either! That's why I'm talking 9"ers and D44's, and not D60's.

 

If you can float the cash have Currie build you a custom 9 front and rear WMS-WMS. Put them on and don't worry about it. Just keep them lubed and greased.

I had them build me a custon WT rear. 44 Center with 9 inch outters. This allowed me to use the detroit and gears I had in my NT 44 but still have the strenght of the 9inch tubes and bearings. This does mean they have custom shafts that will have to be ordered from Currie if they ever bend or break. The shafts they sent me are a stonger alloy then stock and should have no problems holding the power you are talking about. The bonus of this is I can mount Ford 9 inch rear discs easily in the future If I decide I want to.

 

Hudsonhawk: One of my goals with this axle endeavor is to go wider, but not full size width. Basically, if I go the aftermarket route, I would use the Currie "crate" rearend for a CJ, which is widetrack width, and I would match whichever front end to the WT width as well.

Question: What has been your experience going to the WT front end? Turning radius? Tire clearance? etc.

Thanks!

 

There is no doubt that custom axles, especially front ends cost big time $. I am not too excited about that, but I do plan on holding on to this Jeep, so If I go the aftermarket route, I will just keep on saving my pennies! The reason for my post is to get me going down the right path! Do I drop 2k into the 30 or do I bite the bullet on a 9", do I go with CJ knuckles, or go WMS to WMS, etc etc etc?

Thanks!

 

Just go Dana 60's and be done with it...

 

60's are strong but many times are also overkill.
And they are just darn heavy.

If you are going to run 37's or larger, and big power,then they would be a good argument.

You havnt mentioned what tire size you are settling on..

 

Thanks Patrick! That is correct - 35's are the goal! Right now, I am running 33's, but those tires and wheels will eventually end up under my '46 CJ-2A and I want to move up to 35's for the CJ-6. I'm not looking for a monster Jeep...these days, 35's are even considered small in some circles. The main reason I want the 35's is for the extra clearance and the breakover angle due to the longer wheel base. (Plus, with the extra wheel base, CJ-6's were just made for 35's in my eyes!) Keep in mind that I am running 33's on the stock axles for the time being, however my long term goals include 35's, so as I build and make improvements, I want to build for where I'm going to be, not for where I am.

So far, let me see if I have this aftermarket knuckle question straight:
- Aftermarket axles use stock type knuckles so users can bolt on existing parts.
- Aftermarket axles can be custom ordered, thus eliminating any perceived weak links.

Any ideas on my Currie High Pinion front end question? Is it in fact stronger than a low pinion would be since it is used in the front? (I realize it uses an 8.8" ring gear).

Also, how about the aftermarket D44's? How do these compare price, strength, weight, etc. with the CHP?

Thanks!

 

Patrick,

Yeah, I plan on staying spring under. I'm taking everything into consideration. While I do like the width of the later CJ Wide Track axles, I don't want full size truck width axles. I know that sounds picky, but I still want the Jeep to look like a CJ. While some may argue that WT axles, shackle reversal, and 35" tires have already detracted enough from it looking like a CJ, if they saw the Jeep, I believe they would say it still holds on to its roots.

How available are Wagoneer axles? Aren't some of them 6 lugs? How wide are they?

 

The high pinion(HP) is techinically stronger in a front end application. A low pinion (LP) config in the rear is stronger than an HP would be. In a front end application, with a normal low pinion axle, when you apply power, it is being applied to the "coast side" of the ring gear instead of the normal "drive side" This can cause more ring deflection, and is generally weaker. A HP front reverses the cut of the gears so you are now applying fore to the drive side. You will also see High pinion called "reverse rotation" which is sort of a misnomer, since the axle still spins in the same rotation.

The net effect is that a HP is stronger in front applications, but the only part that is stronger is the ring and pinion itself. HP or LP there is no difference in strength of the axle tubes, shafts, u-joints, knuckles, etc... The major advantage to the HP axle is greatly improved driveline angles since, as the name says, the pinion is 5-6+" higher on a HP rear.

However, I've never seen anyone grenade a d30 ring a pinion set even with lockers and big hp. The shafts fail much sooner, rendering the strength advantage moot. Same thing with the d44.


Bottom line: IF you are going for custom axles, might as well go HP in the front for the better driveling axles and possible strength upgrade. The cost differential between a hp or lp custom axle is probably not much.

 

There is a 1973 Cherokee down at Albuquerque U Pull It, It has the 5 lug pattern 44 rear and a 30 front.

Andrew

 

Wider track. and you don't have to outboard the springs.

 

Wow i missed that...

 

You can use a Wagoneer front Dana 44 with the 6 lug bolt pattern and just swap out the hubs for ones off a Bronco or Ford pick-up. Spindles, bearings and hubs are a driect swap. You would also only need to shorten one side of the Wagonner Axle to make it fit as a wide track axle.