302 in a jeep???

for a second i thought the zombie armies were closing in... this thread was long dead.

the 351 is a good deal wider than a 302. but i believe hes talking about the 350 Chevy, and the 302 ford.

Yes it can be done, my question is.... If you already have a v6, why on earth would you want a v8 in one of these old jeeps.

I can see the v8 if going from the 4cyl. but i think your peeing into the wind going from a v6 to a v8.

I wont lie, not having a motor at all for the jeep, and having a rebuildable 305 chevy setting in a barn knowing its just setting... its tempting to drop it in. I still think the v6 is the best choice though.....

 

Well in my current situation i have a 250 ford inline 6. It has been remarkable and never skipped a beat in over 30 years. However, now that im calling the shots with the CJ and not my father who originaly built it, i would like to fit a ford 302w. Is not an every day vehicle so im not worried about fuel. The power increase will be fun to say the least. I am building this engine with torque in mind. Im not buiding a race engine.

Basically all i want is massive torque at low rpm, and a mean exhaust note. To acheive this goal its V8 time!

Anyone got pics of a 302 ford in an early jeep??

 

My first Jeep was a 46 2-a, being a Ford lover I installed a 302 and c-4 auto. The one thing that made it easy was a short water pump kit that was offered at the time by White performance that was made for street rodders to install Fords into Fords. I don't know if this is still avaliable or not, but the new solution is a pump from Ford performance that is shorter than the normal pump. I have not looked at the catalog in a long time because they don't make one to fit a Cleveland and I need a sort pump solution for that motor. If you use it you might have to go to serpintine belt and reverse flow pump. This might be better anyway.
I did not have to cut the firewall but I did trim the grill and make a mount to fit the radiator.

 

Thanks for the sharing the pics bkd! Just what i needed.

sdcj6, thats interesting about the short water pump. I was looking at the WP i just bought a few months ago and it looks to be too long. Well, too long for my application anyway. I will definatley look into a short shaft pump.
Cheers!

...AJ

 

I had a freind that ran a 302 in a flatfender. Most reliable Jeep in the area. Plenty of power and all he ever did to it was change the oil. He drove that thing everywhere. That was at least 15 years ago. It is still in the area and as I hear it, the only thing that has changed since then is new wiring.

 

No personal experience with any of these motors ... however ..

You say you want low-end torque and the V8 exhaust note. In general, the bore:stroke ratio determines the RPM range where the torque peak happens. Long stroke equals a torque peak at a comparatively low RPM. A good example of this is the lonnnngg stroke F134 engine, where the torque peaks at around 2000 RPM. Compare that to shorter stroke engines and you'll see their torque peaks at higher RPMs. Recall that horsepower is basically torque times engine speed, so to get more power without increasing displacement generally means moving the torque curve up, ie so that it peaks at a higher RPM. This means less torque at low RPMs, generally.

If I wanted a V8 with lots of torque at low RPM, I would not look to the 289 or 302. Without looking at the numbers, these fine engines are known for having a short stroke. Lots of power, but if you want slow-speed grunt, I predict these engines aren't the best choice. If it were mine, I would instead look to the small-block Buicks 300/340/350 or for a bigger engine, the 472/500 Cadillac. The Caddy is a fine engine - compact, reliable, and inexpensive on the used market.

If you want a really modern engine, with fully electronic fuel and spark control, I would look to whatever Detroit puts into their really big cars - typically engines for big cars have a lot of grunt at low RPM, so that these cars get off the line quickly and seem more peppy and nimble.

Also, look at this from a displacement POV. Thre is no replacement for displacement. A 250 isn't that far off from a 302 in displacement, and even though the 302 will have more power when you wind it out, I predict its off-the-line feel at low speed won't be that different from the 250.

I think the 250 is the same bell as the 302, but it still has the same terrible cast-in intake manifold as the 144/170/200 ... you could consider a swap to a 240/300 engine and get a intake configuration that is more friendly to upgrades, and get a significant boost in power. This is not a V8, but with the right exhaust system it would sound good. The 300 is also a long stroke engine IIRC, and is known for making lot of torque at low speed. There is a significant pickup owner community out there that would help with speed parts and advice. The 240/300 is longer than the 250, but you already have a firewall notch, and making a little more room might not be so much trouble.

hth!

<edit> I just noticed that you are located in Australia - thus your choices may be limited. The gist of this stands, but the specific suggestions aren't going to help. I still wonder how much low-end-torque gain you'll see from the 302 over the 250 though.

 

Hi timgr,

Some very interesting facts in there thanks. And yes living in Aus does leave me with a limited option of parts/engines etc.
The 302w i am building will have a edelbrock performer manifold (designed for low down power and towing) and also a comp cam (range 1200 - 5500). So this engine will be alot more than the 250 ever was.
I am fully aware of stroke etc and how thats pretty much the main factor when going for torque, the 250 is a great engine in that regard. But like i said, its time for a change and V8 is where im going.
That said, i was going to put in a 4.0l from a cherokee and have an injected 6 but i still want a v8.
I have always had a thing for V8's and cant afford to own another car so i may as well put a V8 in my jeep. The CJ5 is a vehicle that i will never part with. And possibly one day down the track do another type of engine conversion if i am not totally satisfied with the out come of the 302w. So for now thats the direction i am heading.

This is also the slowest conversion in history due to funds running low, saving for a house, loan repayments etc so it sort of come's along in bursts. Once i get a bit closer with the project il post up again my latest hurtles.

Thanks all for your help,

..AJ

 

Don’t let these guys get you down, a V-8 in one of these things is a bunch of fun.
And, IMO, adds to the flexibility as a trail rig.
My wheeling friends with 4 and 6 cylinder rigs have to be a lot more selective in what gear they are in when going through mixed terrain. For the most part I can idle around in low range 2nd or 3rd gear and if I need to bump a tire over a stump or rock I just burp the throttle. Then if there is a mud pit between me and point B, I can just give the throttle a hard poke and whip up RPM’s and wheel speed almost instantly.
Wheeling with a 4 cylinder in particular, if you find yourself in the wrong gear in the middle of a mud pit and have to clutch and shift gears you're more than likely stuck because you just lost all momentum.
Of course, from that stand point you could say it takes more skill to wheel a rig with a smaller engine but I’ll go for the fun factor anyway.

 

Unless you are a die hard Ford fan (and their engines are every bit as good as Chevy) why not go w/ a small block Chevy? From ease of maintenance, reliability, ease of getting parts, power making potential if desired, you just can't beat them. I have a warmed up 283 that puts out over 300hp. Plenty of power for a CJ5! I have never been in a situationj where I did not have enough power! My 2 cents...

 

Thanks sierraflyfisher,
Probably the main reason i want to run a 302w ford is due to the fact the distributer is at the front. And the fact that i purchased another jeep for parts (CJ6) and it had the 302w already in it with the T18 already mated to it. So thats where i picked up the engine i am building.
Looking back on it now i probably could have done a chev engine as they are 1.5" shorter in length. And it looks like length is a major factor when doing this swap in a short nose.

 

Understandable and not a bad choice and a very good motor but a Chevey can be done without cutting the firewall if done correctly. Good luck!

 

Well, before you go cutting on the firewall consider using a body lift and/or just flat mounting the motor lower in the frame (assuming you’re using weld in mounts) for clearance.
And I would search long and hard for that short water pump. That would probably make a big difference right there.