Baffling Dauntless Timing

I have a 67 cj5 made from parts.
I bought it that way, I know big mistake.
It has a 1978 even fire engine.
Last year I found out with some help from here, that my engine had an odd fired ignition in an even fired engine.
I fixed that problem but was still not been happy with the way the engine ran.

The snow finally melted, the other day, so I could get the old cj out.
Started right up, but I am still gettin a lot of popping out of the exhaust on the passenger side.
Had bought a new timing light this winter, thinking my old one maybe wasn't reading correctly.
Put the new timing light on there yesterday, and no matter where I adjust the timing on the distributor, the engine is still popping out of the passenger side.

The engine was rebuilt before I bought the cj.

I have fixed, rebuilt or replaced every part that I can think of.
What I'm wondering is since the engine was bastardized from the start, if maybe there are some internal parts that could throw off the timing?
My only other thought would be the timing chain, it's really the only thing I haven't touched.

Any ideas?

Jim

 

There are different caps for the Dauntless Delco ignition. They will screw you up on one bank.

 

Cap is a good place to start. Was it doing this before it's hibernation or is there a possibility something is sticky from sitting?

 

For it to run properly, The crank, cam, and distributor all need to match odd-fire or even fire. Some Pulling the oil pan to look at the crank, and a valve cover to check the cam may be in order. Odd-fire crank will have shared connecting rod pins. Even fire will have offset pins. To check the cam, you should be at TDC during valve overlap on all cylinders.

All that said, if it's a rebuild engine, did you break in the cam properly? A flat lobe can cause popping.

 

I had the exact same problem with my odd fire that sat for 10 years before I bought it. Stuck lifters after they collapsed, stuck valves, bent push rods. Compression test is what clued me in. If it's running, you can do a vacuum gauge test as well. Might give you some clues. I had a sloppy timing chain as well. I say start with a compression test. Leak down test also.

 

What if in the rebuild the rocker arm assembly was put in bassackwards?

It makes no sense to me at all why one side of the engine would run great, and the other side can run so poorly.
Doesn't matter if it's at idle, or me puttin the juice to her, it pops out of the passenger side exhaust.
I do think it runs worse now than last fall.

It might have something to do with that even fire/oddfire cam.
When I got it, she had an oddfired cap on an even fired engine.
So, I could see the wrong cam being in there.

Jim

 

If you have not pulled your pan off...you should do so to determine what engine you have. Being that it was built in a crossover year, it is the best
way to tell absolutely what engine you have. No one will be able to help you until that is known for sure. Three rod journals verses six. Three is odd
and six is even.

 

I chased a problem similar to this for years on my oddfire. Driver side plugs always looked good, passenger bad. Exhaust manifold would get measurably hotter on driver side.
Turns out although I had the correct oddfire cap, I had the #1 plug in the wrong place so the "pauses" in the spark were not lining up with the crank. This happened when I tried to clock my distributer and I was always taught it doesn't matter what post #1 is on as long at it is top dead center.... turns out that only works with even fire engines.
Here is a picture
http://www.earlycj5.com/xf_cj5/index.php?resources/6/

 

Sticking valves and lifters are random so it could be your problem. I would start running diagnostic tests. Build a leak down tester.

 

I agree with finoCJ also. I'm thinking this is your first step before bothering to diagnose anything. Listen to these guys. You have to return to a baseline.

 

The engine block casting numbers tell me that it's a 1978 evenfire.
I've been through this a lot. lol

I'll pull the pan to check and let you know what I find.

I did not catch the part about the flat cam lobe till now, how would you figure that out?

Offhand another thought along the cam line, but what about a collapsed lifter?

I'm almost ready to turn into a piece of yard art. lol

Jim

 

Pics won't upload.
The block casting numbers are GM 1255862
Two connecting rods go to one journal.
Tell me what I have, since GM says they never made an oddfired engine, and they didn't start manufacturing v6 engines till 1977.
Now I'm really baffled. lol

It didn't run any better with the original oddfired cap that was on the HEI.

Jim

 

Off the net.

 

This is what an odd fire crank looks like:


This is what an even fire crank looks like:


As discussed in your thread last year, your casting number covers 1977 and 1978 engines. The even fire was transitioned in mid year 1977 so your casting number could be either. ....and that assuming is has that parts that came with it. Since it's been rebuilt, who know what's in it.

As noted by the wiki page referenced by dnb5853,:

• The Buick V6 came out as a 198 in 1962.
• It grew to a 225ci with a taller deck height and BOP bellhousing in 1964.
• Buick started selling 225 engines to Jeep in 1966.
• Buick stopped making the V6 for themselves and sold all the tooling to Jeep in 1967.
• Jeep produced the engine until 1971. After AMC purchased Jeep, they transitioned to AMC inline 6's in 1972 and the V6 tooling fell silent.
• Buick bought the dormant tooling back from Jeep and started producing V6s for Buicks again in 1975 due to the oil crunch. These were odd-fire 231s. They are similar to the old 225s with a few differences like a Buick 350 bore size, Rocker arms oiled through the pushrods rather than pressurized rocker shafts, EGR, larger bore 2GC carburetor, and HEI ignition.
• Mid-year 1977 Buick spit the rod journals to make it an even firing engine for smoother running.

 

Thanks Fireball, that was most helpful.
It is definitely an odd fire crank.
Both connecting rods are in line with each other, on one journal, exactly like your oddfire pic.


So now what? LOL

Jim

 

I would image the camshaft matches the crank, so you need an odd-fire distributor and you need to position it correctly so it fires the #1 cylinder in the right part of the timing sequence.

 

I'll check it out tomorrow, went out and found the odd fire cap, so should be ready to go as soon as I can find another oil pan gasket. lol

The jeep has an HEI ignition is there something other than the cap, that would make the distributor even fire, or odd fire?

It appears that you have the same engine in your 69, wanna swap. LOL

Jim

 

I did find the engine rebuild sheet amongst all the papers I got, cost him $2200 for a rebuild, you'd think it would run. lol
Didn't have a breakdown of parts, bummer.