Head Gasket ?????

1970 CJ5, 134f, T90, Dana 18. Found milky looking stuff clinging to dip stick. No problems with drive ability. Replaced head gasket. New head bolts. Did not mill the head. Used a Fell-pro gasket. Fiber on one side metal on the other. Did not use copper spray on either side. Every thing went back together fine. Runs great even better than before. 60 MPH easy. Still getting milky goo on dip stick. Should I tear it back down and mill the head? Deck the block? (Can this be done with the motor in the jeep?) Use copper spray?

How can i determine if it is something else? Cracked block? Anyone have any input? Thanks Brad.

 

Milkshake on the dipstick is very common in the F-head.

Most often it is from condensation in the crankcase. Be sure the PCV system is full functioning, and that the engine is operating at proper temperature (=thermostat).

Short trips aggravate the problem. The engine needs to be run enough to evaporate any moisture in the oil.

 

Not an expert on the F134, but cracks seem to be common, typically from the exhaust valve to the head bolt. Pressure testing equipment is available.

Why new head bolts? IMO that's a needless expense, and could be trouble if the length is not right.

No, you cannot deck the block with the engine in the car.

Follow Pete's advice and see if the moisture goes away if the engine is operated for a while at full operating temperature.

 

I hope you are right. I have the vent on top of the valve cover that goes to the intake. I cleaned that when the valve cover was off. There is a connection at the oil fill port for a tube to the old oil bath air cleaner. I am using a motorcycle type oiled foam air cleaner so this connection has a cloth cover zip tied on for now. I drive the jeep 10 miles to work. Do you think this is far enough? The stock temp. gauge reads the mid point.

 

Old bolts were unusable. To corroded. New bolts with washers from Kaiser Willys seem to be the same. What about the copper spray. It was 50-50 on the general internet whether or not to use it. Fell-pro was no help for any instillation instructions.

 

If you got the blue Felpro gasket, it should say "no sealant needed" on the box. Regardless, if you prepared the surfaces well, and it seems ok now, I would just leave it and look elsewhere. If you have a crack between the water passage and the sump, you should be able to detect it with a cooling system pressure checker.

Also, I expect if the Felpro gasket were not blue (teflon on both sides), Felpro is repackaging someone else's gasket for sale through their distribution network. Not an issue, but it's likely not a "real" Felpro gasket.

 

Are you losing coolant? Antifreeze in the drained oil? Does the engine miss/skip when first started in the morning? Water drops found on a cold sparkplug? Exhaust gas in the radiator? White smoke from tailpipe? All possible signs of a gasket problem.

Timgr is right about block cracks, and also when a head gasket blows on an F-head it is often between adjacent cylinders.

Cylinder compression test, exhaust sniffer at the radiator, are two easy tests.

 

So just to be clear, it is only a foam on the dipstick above the oil level? The oil itself looks fine?

I agree with everything that's been said. It sounds like either an engine temperature and/or a crankcase breathing issue to me. If your PCV setup is working as it should be, and you are certain the thermostat is working correctly (maybe pull it and test it in a pot of water on the stove with a candy thermometer), run it as you normally would for a few weeks while keeping an eye on the coolant level. If still milky, try this: jack up the rear of the vehicle as high as you can safely lift it, drain the oil, replace the drain plug, lower it back down, then pull the oil pan to inspect if/how much water is in the pan. Raising the rear will keep any water in the pan and will be easier to see and diagnose if it is just water (heavy condensation) or antifreeze (crack or leaky gasket). If no water is present, try a thermostat with a higher temp.


FWIW, I just replaced a head gasket on one of these, and the Felpro instructions stated to use a copper spray on the metal side only.

 

Pennzoil conventional high milage 10w40. 66K miles on jeep. Only milky on dipstick above oil level. Oil looks and smells fine. Will do some more driving and check coolant level. I was loosing coolant before head gasket replacement. I will check compression ASAP. No white smoke (moisture) from tail pipe. Weather since head gasket replacement has been 30 at night and 70 day. Lots of NC foothills humidity. Runs great from cold start up to 60 MPH. (Better than before head gasket repair.) Where did you find the Felpro instructions. I spoke to a Felpro rep. that told me Felpro does not publish instructions for a reason but would not say what the reason was. He told me I should refer to the Factory Service Manual. The service manual I used did not mention any sealant.

 

O yes new 160 thermostat verified to be functioning properly.

 

Brad. A 160 thermostat? FSM for my '66 F4 states 180. If really a 160, you may never properly heat up during operation

 

Your motorcycle type air cleaner is not optimal for a Jeep, in my opinion. The original oil bath air cleaners are designed to draw crankcase vapors in, rather than simply venting them to the in-coming air. Your temperature ranges you are operating in can easily cause condensation, especially in the dipstick tube.
As ITLKSEZ asks, is the oil clear on the dipstick below the oil level? If so, then you as probably experiencing condensation due to both temperature fluctuations and poor crankcase ventallation.
If the oil itself is milky, then you are getting coolant in the oil. Did you install the head bolt hiding in the carb hole? I have seen this forgotten with results similar to yours.
-Donny

 

They came in the complete engine kit.



Here's the instructions, under "metal faced gasket":



And for arguments sake, the service manual specifies using sealant on both sides, but I'm not sure what the original gasket material was made out of.

 

My 1970 134 jeep had the milky oil in the dipstick. I flushed oil 2 times after I had changed the head gasket and then I redid the pcv valve after some recomendations from here. All was good afterwards.
Also...i used spray on gasket stuff on both sides. First time I forgot to "burp" the radiator hose and a superheated air pocket blew my new gasket.

 

Thanks a bunch for the instructions, just printed your post. I did install a new head bolt in the carb. hole. The oil is not milky, only the top of the dip stick and the dipstick/fill tube. All of this sounds quiet promising. I am going to check my crank case venting.

 

When I had this problem pvc was problem I blew out all the pvc lines pulled apart pvc and cleaned it, I'd also check vacuum too.

Jon

 

Ok. Removed the head again last night. Will be delivering it to the machine shop for resurfacing Mon. am. No apparent cracks visible on the top of block or the head but will look closer in a day or so. Will also try to look into the passages with a bore scope. Will talk with the machine shop for recommendations for a new gasket and their opinions on sealers. At the very least I will take the advice of ITLKSEZ and his FIT instructions. Plan to reuse my new head bolts. Any one with any advice now would be a good time. Thanks Brad.