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FI a Dauntless

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Warloch, Apr 15, 2009.

  1. Aug 31, 2010
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    The problem with the underseat tank is, where do you vent it to? In other words, how do you get the vent "outside" the interior of the Jeep. suppose you could go straight through the wheelwell and vent into the wheel opening. Hmmm, bears some thought.

    Warloch: I received my new fuel pump today. Bought the one you recommended. Figured I needed a backup pump for the trail anyway. I'll use the Retrotek supplied one for that.
     
  2. Aug 31, 2010
    cj6/442

    cj6/442 Sponsor

    Fallbrook, Calif
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    I was tired of constantly leaking fuel out the vented cap, since I have no gauge , on the sender ,I ran a tipover valve to braided line and taped into the roll bar . on the pass side I drilled a 1/2" hole and vent it that way , no matter which side the jeep is laying on the fuel is contained , just a thought for your problem.
     
  3. Aug 31, 2010
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    I like it!
     
  4. Aug 31, 2010
    cj6/442

    cj6/442 Sponsor

    Fallbrook, Calif
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    I'll get a pic then .
     
  5. Aug 31, 2010
    '74Renegade

    '74Renegade Active Member

    Fair Oaks, CA
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    Me too. I am sick of gas leaking out of the filler neck.
     
  6. Aug 31, 2010
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I ran mine from the middle of the top to a hose with a filter on it and it's attached along side the filler hose that goes up the inside of the back fender.

    I think your gonna be real pleased with it - I know I am. From @7K here to camp - up the roads - over Taylor pass and up the ridges @ 12,5 to 13+ and not even a hickup. Rough roads (places I know a carb would hickup) - off camber, over rocks in a steep climb...

    Now that I am home, it's trying to redo the idle on a cold start - nothing that concerns me at all though.
     
  7. Aug 31, 2010
    cj6/442

    cj6/442 Sponsor

    Fallbrook, Calif
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    sure wish i had this for this trip I'm going on starts at 8500 to just under 11.
     
  8. Jan 19, 2011
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Just for the record

    IF you get the nice quite WALBRO GSL392 pump you will need some special fittings. I got mine from a company on ebay (where I got my pump) called fuelpumpsusa... Part No was 3039 for the -6 fitting.

    Male 10mm to -6 is what I used.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2011
  9. Jan 19, 2011
    grannyscj

    grannyscj Headed to the Yukon

    Anchorage, AK
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    For future reference, does the PJIII use AN fittings or something else? Reason I ask is I'd like to run AN fittings and braided hose when I do mine.
     
  10. Jan 19, 2011
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    It comes with -6 AN fittings as part of the connections at the throttle body if you get the full kit. You then run your own lines and fittings from there. I believe they offer an optional plumbing kit that is AN as well. I just built my own with Summit parts and braded line.
     
  11. May 29, 2012
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    Warloch, are you familiar with the "levelall" command when you have the PJ3 dashboard open? It gives you a few "extra" menu options. Open the dashboard and type levelall, hit enter. If you open the Edit menus you will see two new sub-menus. Look for "Closed Loop/Injection Mode". In that you can change the injector mode. I got this from a tuner on the PJ Forum. The default setting is 2. Here's how it was explained to me:

    "Just guessing, you are using injector mode 2 which fires each set of injectors once every 4 ignition events. In a 8 cylinder engine that is every revolution. In a 6 cylinder engine if it fires every 4 ignition events it is going more than one revolution. So it looks like it is using more fuel but it is not because it is not based on one rev of the engine. That is why I questioned EC_Tune about using injector mode 4. It fires the injectors once every 3 ignition events or one rev for a V6. You could do a test and switch it to see if there is any difference. "

    I just switched to Injector Mode 4 and am in the process of re-tuning my Powerjection. I had to pull down the torque setting from 220 to 180 to get the idle air/fuel ratio to 13.8 I'll let you know how it turns out. Seems like a logical change to make though. Nice thing about this system is you can make changes, save it as a new cal file and if you don't like it, just go back to the original file.
     
  12. May 30, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    No I had not. In fact, I have not messed with it at all in a while. I also didn't update the rev that I am running as I didn't want to mess something up.

    I will wait to hear how things work for you as it does seem like a good idea. I'll probably play with it after the kids and I do some wheeling this July.

    As an aside - I just ordered the EZ-EFI to put on the kids rig to try it. If it does not work, I will move it to the wife's Mustang, but wanted to look at another option for the OF motors as it is.
     
  13. Jun 12, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    So I just pressure tested the EZ-EFI setup on the boys jeep - things look fine. I'll do it's first fire this week (it's never been started with a carb, so this ought to be fun ;) ).

    Just some additional info - they did an update and added a module to use with HEI ignition that is supposed to make it easier to run without an ignition box. That's good as MSD has stopped making the only one they had that supported the Odd Fire.

    I will do a parts list/write up of do's and don'ts with this when I am done for folks.

    DON'T use thier hose and fittings - god what a PITA and after 20 mins on one fitting I just went back to the Summit stuff - takes less than 2 mins to put an AN fitting on with thier product(s).
     
  14. Jun 13, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Got a bit of time this afternoon and "It Fired up" {after a bit of a fight to get the timing close enough to go}... but no issues with the Fuel Injection. I ran it for @ 20 mins before my son's botch job on a Rad overflow puked all over the shop floor.

    I'll start to snap some pics, then button up all the wiring I hooked as a temp incase it didn't work (and it ended up on the wife's '66 Mustang).

    Tom Woods drive lines are due tomorrow, so I should be able to get this done for Fathers Day ;)
     
  15. Jul 19, 2012
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    Hey Warloch,
    I'm still fine tuning my PJ, but am happy so far with changing the injector pulse. Actually it's running the best it ever has. I'm just working on smoothing out the cold start area, although I can't really get a true cold start here with morn. temps in the
    60's. I know your engine is putting out more HP than mine, but I've got my torque setting down to 175. At that setting I have the Adaptive Learn at -10 in the idle cell. Supposedly that's the ideal range for the idle cell, actually -10 to -12. I'm heading down to Rubicon Springs tomorrow for it's first real shakedown cruise of the season. Once I feel like I'm "there" on the PJ, I'll send you a calibration file and you can look at the differences.
     
  16. Jul 19, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Thanks - I'll definatly look into it.

    I have been playing with the EZ-EFI on the '49. It's a different principle as you don't get as much info, or options to mess with. Still seems to run good though.
     
  17. Oct 31, 2012
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    Warloch,

    New here but have followed this thread for a while............

    I have a 65 Cj5 that I put a Odd fire in back around 1971...........I had the pleasure of meeting Kenne Bell & Doug Jones at a race in Pomona about the same time. They helped me sort out what I have now with an Isky Cam ( where his was ground) and a few other odds and ends, oil pump, Offy manifold ( he had not yet fully developed the KB 1 manifold yet) Holley 390 CFM with a spacer ETC.

    Fast forward to 2012 after having that Jeep in storage for 28 years I'm looking to hop it up a little.

    What are you using for cylinder heads on your motor?
    Are you still happy with the PowerJection III on your Odd Fire?
    How did you solve the Odd fire pulse? I see there was a mention of a MSD Module but never quite understood if you used it or even needed it?
    Was there any reason you did not use the non Re-turn line system.
    Have you looked at the new MSD Atomic EFI system?

    Your help would be appreciated.

    Thanks Terry
     
  18. Oct 31, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    The heads on this motor are a set worked by Kenne Bell back in the day. The motor was originally built for the Pikes Peak Hill Climb race, so it's got a lot of 'special' items in it.

    I am still very happy with the PJIII setup. I have also installed the EZ-EFI on another 225 (Blue '49) and am very happy with it as well, but have not wheeled it hard yet. For future rigs, I may lean toward the EZ-EFI as it has off the shelf replacement parts (more so than the PJIII). While there is more wiring to the EZ-EFI, it's not hard to sort out (pics via email if you want them).

    The MSD module is no longer an option, it's not made any longer. There is no issue with the pulse with either setup when using an HEI distributor. It's as I have always said - RPM is RPM and the computers don't care as it just measures the 6 fire pulses (or what ever the cyl count is set to in the program) for 1 rev and goes from there.

    The non return setups didn't have good reviews at the time I did all of this. I just wanted to limit the possible problems, and by the time you figure the extra cost of the non return setups, the extra line was cheaper anyway.

    When I talked to the MSD folks, they were not keen on running it with just the HEI as they didn't feel the signal was going to be 'clean enough' for them. Since they don't have a box as an option, they fell off the board for me.

    Hope that helps. I have a lot more on the EZ-EFI, I just have not taken the time to update my site and I lost the ability to do easy updates there (just got to carve out the time I guess - and learn more HTML)...
     
  19. Oct 31, 2012
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    :pChuck,

    Would love to see that wiring on the EZ-EFI.
    Any Source for an HEI Distributor for the Odd Fire?
    Yeh KB talked about doing a set of heads for me back in the day........but $$$ back then was an issue......later on Diamond Racing was also involved in that Buick head development program but I missed that window as now both of those guys are now in poor health.
    What do you know about putting the later 231 heads on a 225? I know there is some water hole issues and the rocker & oiling to the valve train is a little different...........anyone you know have any luck?

    New here so if these questions should be directed via a PM let me know.

    Thanks Terry
     
  20. Oct 31, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    PM me your address and I'll e-mail you the pics for now.

    The HEI can be built http://warloch.com/Manuals/HEI%20Even%20To%20Odd%20Instructions.pdf
    or purchased http://crtperformance.com/html/buick_hei.html
    I recommend the wires from CRT no matter what.

    As to the 231 heads on the 225, you also have to get the angle corrected so the intakes fit cleaner (going from memory). Most of the time I recommend working the 225 heads or getting with TA Performance. I believe they still do head work for the 225s (I know they do for the 231s). I have Pat Ganahl's V6 book and a lot of the success hinges on which heads you use. The real trick most builders try to do is find, or make the parts needed for that 'last year' of the 231 Odd Fire.

    The roller valve train I have is one of the best deals you can get to help with your setup. I think TA does them now too.
     
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