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Dauntless V6 Mini Starter

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Norcal69, Sep 11, 2021.

  1. Sep 13, 2021
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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    Mmm. I don't know about the "R" terminal, but on the Ford solenoid (the common inner-fender-mounted type, Standard SS581) they will have an "S" for start, and usually (not always) an "I" for ignition.

    The S terminal energizes the solenoid coil to connect the battery cable to the starter motor cable.

    The I terminal connects internally to the starter cable, and goes to 12V when the starter motor is running. This can be used on cars with points ignition to power the coil with a full 12V when starting, bypassing the ballast resistor. On the Prestolite Jeeps, the I terminal is missing, since they don't have any ballast resistor. On the Duraspark Jeeps (and Fords I presume) the I terminal goes to the ignition module and signals the module to retard the spark for starting. So maybe "R" is retard?
     
  2. Sep 13, 2021
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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    They exist, but aren't up to the field strength of your typical hospital MRI. MR signal strength goes like the field strength while noise is constant, thus the supercons have a huge advantage in scan time to the others. You have to make up for the signal quality with more averaging; signal adds constructively while noise does not. Half the field strength, four times the scan time (roughly).

    The link below is a little out of date. Your typical hospital system is 3T (3 Tesla, 30,000 Gauss) and Siemens latest flagship is 7T. A 0.3T permanent magnet system will require 100 times the scan time of a 3T, as long as the system noise does not overwhelm the signal averaging before equivalence is reached. In reality, the main constraint is the limited number of available protocols (types of scans) that you can do economically with the lower field strength. Throughput is the central economic issue for these installations.

    Magnets (types) | Radiology Reference Article | Radiopaedia.org.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2021
  3. Sep 13, 2021
    Mjragan

    Mjragan Member

    socal-Simi Valley
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    Lots of good info there Thanks for sharing.
    Great point on the starter bolts, just an FYI for many of us with older gm vehicles with starter mounting bolts that are 3/8", at some point GM started using metric 10mm starter bolts on some but not on all their engines. The 10mm bolt hole is about .020" larger than the 3/8" bolt hole, if you use the 3/8" starter bolts on a 10mm starter it will cause an alignment problem. Some of the replacement starters for the older GM vehicles with 3/8"starter bolts have the 10mm mounting bolt holes and do not include new bolts, They are sold as direct replacements and will fit but there is a good chance of flexplate/flywheel damage if you don't use conversion bolts, the starter mounting bolts should fit snug into the starter bolt holes. I install a lot of A/C Delco starters they are a good starter but many years ago I was trying to get a starter for a 70 Camaro and I kept getting 10mm starters from my A/C Delco distributor I called the A/C Delco tech assist number an was told that A/C Delco no longer supported SAE standard? All the rebuilt starters from A/C Delco where using metric nose cases with metric bolt sizes, I don't know if that is still the case but if you have a 3/8" GM engine and you need to replace your starter double check to make sure you are using the right bolts.
    On a side note last week I installed a new not rebuilt GM crate motor it is a direct replacement for the application, 2001 Chevy 350 R code. The new engine came with 3/8"x 16 starter bolt threads and the original engine had 10 x 1.5mm threads????
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2021
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  4. Sep 15, 2021
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Northern California
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    Here is a little video for those curious about the starter sound. It sounds a bit more modern than the old school whine and spins much faster.
    Sorry boys this is a crank over video only. No open header startups today....

     
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  5. Sep 18, 2021
    cjsammyowner

    cjsammyowner Member

    Paxtonia, Pa
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    Does this upgrade require the use of a 153 tooth ring gear for the flywheel?
     
  6. Sep 18, 2021
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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    You can hear the high speed of the motor when it shuts off. A final "whirr."
     
  7. Feb 10, 2022
    garage gnome

    garage gnome ECJ5 welder

    Western MA
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    I just did this swap to Snowshoe, what a difference!
     
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  8. Feb 11, 2022
    fhoehle

    fhoehle Sponsor

    Harford Township, PA
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    Excellent information! Much obliged!
     
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  9. Feb 11, 2022
    Bearskin10

    Bearskin10 New Member 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Lakewood,CA
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    I already have an extra starter sitting in my garage but I think I may have to get me one of these!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  10. Feb 12, 2022
    zinertia2

    zinertia2 "and which part are you keeping?" 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

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    Samarium cobalt magnets or Neodymium Iron Boron magnets?
    Used samarium cobalt in the stepper motors in the Hubble telescope.
    Greater temp range for the samarium but somewhat lower field.
    Dennis
     
  11. Feb 12, 2022
    givemethewillys

    givemethewillys Been here since sparky ran it. 2022 Sponsor

    New Kent, VA
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    X2, I have 2 unknowns sitting on the shelf.... this is definitely on my radar.
     
  12. Feb 16, 2022
    Bearskin10

    Bearskin10 New Member 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Lakewood,CA
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    Ok so if I am reading this right I only have the "S" which is the "I" on the Powermasters So I would get the Powermaster 9201 instead of the 9202 that you got?
     
  13. Feb 17, 2022
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

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    The "I" terminal is the same as the "S" terminal on an old style starter. The "I" or "S" receives the signal from your ignition switch and tells the starter bendix to come out to the flywheel.
    The "R" terminal sends voltage to the ignition when the key is in the cranking position. This is a momentary 12V worth of power to get the engine running.
    I am not familiar with the stock jeep wiring setup and do not know if you need both terminals. You can use a starter with out an "I" or "S" terminal, but you will need to put a diode in the ignition power feed so that once the ignition is running it will not back feed to the starter. My harness is aftermarket, but I needed the "R" terminal for the engine cranking signal for fuel injection.
     
  14. Feb 22, 2022
    Bondo

    Bondo Master General Re-Engineer,...

    Greenfield Me.
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    Great thread that answered my hunch,....
    While crawlin' under my new to me CJ, when I looked over the big ole starter on the Dauntless, I was thinkin' that it Looks exactly like a Chevy starter for the small flywheel Chevy,....
    This thread confirms that when that big ole starter sh!ts the bed, I'll be slappin' on the new PM boat starter I've got on the shelf,.....

    The PM starters are Great,.... 1/2 the weight, 'n nearly twice the power,.....
     
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  15. Feb 22, 2022
    amboynut

    amboynut Member

    Chelatchie, WA
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    I knew that.
     
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  16. Jun 10, 2022
    Andrew Theros

    Andrew Theros Member 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Los Osos, CA
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    Chalk up another one for @Norcal69

    just swapped one in. Thank you!
     
  17. Jun 10, 2022
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

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    Another one here too on the Buick 350 in the '71. Thanks much!
     
  18. Jun 17, 2022
    Ollie2009

    Ollie2009 Member

    Ann Arbor, MI
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    I'd like to know this also. My flywheel has 160 teeth.
     
  19. Jun 17, 2022
    Bearskin10

    Bearskin10 New Member 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Lakewood,CA
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    Item description at Summit says 153 tooth flywheel....
     
  20. Jun 17, 2022
    tomasinator

    tomasinator Member

    Redmond, WA
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    I ordered the Power Master 9202, recommended by FIREBALL. It came with the correct SAE bolts for my '70 Dauntless. The size and weight difference between the Power Master and the original is pretty dramatic.
    [​IMG]

    Installed.
    [​IMG]
     
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