'63 CJ6 Perkins Rebuild

Hi Mitch;

I'm sorry to hear about the trouble. Winter is normally when these things come up with diesels. I suggest starting with the most simple diagnostics first and not assume that it's the injector pump/injectors. Drain the fuel tank into a very clean container and look for water in the fuel. I would even remove the tank completely quite honestly. My old tank was really gummed up so I rinsed it for 2 days with denatured alcohol, taping all openings and shaking whenever I walked by. The crud that came out was incredible and it came out squeaky clean. Dry tank with compressed air or heat gun. Start with clean, treated fuel.

Change the primary and secondary fuel filters. Crack the lines right at the injectors to re-prime and see how it runs. Even if it doesn't solve the problem, you've done something that will need to be done anyway if you change the pump and injectors. I realize I'm stating a lot of very obvious things but that's what I would do.

I cannot suggest anyone for the injector work because my project engine came with rebuilt units. What I may be able to help with is part references but as far as sources, I haven't had to go there yet.

Hopefully the coolant leak isn't the head gasket although this shouldn't be a big deal. Taking off the upper tranny cover to have a look makes sense.

 

Mitch, the 4.192 was used in the Massey Ferguson 65 mk.1 tractor so if you're in an agricultural area, you might try a tractor repair shop for rebuilding the injectors and pump.

Also, have a look at this video. This guy seems to know what he's doing....he makes it look sort of easy.



And here's another video which explains the design of this type of pump. It's an OLD but very cool video.



Pete

 

Mitch: I don't know if they *still* do it, but when I was working for Detroit Diesel, we used Sierra Diesel Injection in Reno for rebuilding the old mechanical injectors and pumps. I did a quick google, and I can't tell if they're still doing that sort of work or not, but might be worth a call.

 

Actually, this pump is hydraulic...not that it makes any difference. That first video above shows a mechanical rebuild and it looks like the hydraulic is even simpler. You don't have to deal with the indexing spring and actuator.

Here's a shop not too far away that that looks as though the work on older pumps; Rebuilt injection pump, injectors or turbo for your Perkins engine.

Here's a Ebay link but it comes from the UK; Perkins 4.192 & P4.203 Marine Diesel Injection/Injector Pump

For sure you'll need a DPA number and any shop you deal with will want a core.

 

Wow, that is cool, I have never seen one before, now I want one too. When my wife and I got married in 67, we inherited a 1927 Phantom I Rolls Royce that my Grandfather bought for advertising his business. It was rough but cool. The engine had been replaced with a Perkins bus motor. A P-6 six cylinder. The block was cracked from freezing, but was welded. I drove it home to Detroit from Chattanooga Tenn. in Sept of 1967. We drove it around for seven years, went to the beach, drive in and cruised McDonalds, we had a great time in it. The motor was great running and probably better than the factory P-1 motor for the old heavy car. I had it for 35 years, apart most of the time. I got the chassis restored, chromed the small parts on the motor, and painted the frame and chassis, but The wooden framed body was too much for me, I sold it about 15 years ago, it is back in England now all redone. Any way I was impressed by the quality of the Perkins engine, they are one of the very best diesel's made. good luck to you I am jealous, I would love to have a motor like that to play with. Best of luck to you with your cool project.

 

Hi Peter-
The Jeep still runs relatively well... With the jeep sitting for so long, the first thing I did was clean out the tank really well and have changed the filters multiple times, not that they really even needed it as the fuel is clean as diesel goes. The sediment bowl gets very little actual sediment in it. The bigger issue I am having is a loss of power and noxious fumes. Power has noticeably dropped in the time when I first started driving it and currently, plus some very noxious fumes. There was an "old Iron" feature in JP a little while ago where they featured a Perkins CJ-5 with a pto saw attachment and made note of the raised exhaust the owner had added due to fumes.... They also went on to state the fumes were corrected with pump work. I just have the feeling that after sitting for so long that it wouldn't be a bad idea to have the pump rebuilt now that I've run it a bunch and I know for a fact the injectors are at the very least, very dirty just from carbon build up.

I think I'll probably visit the coolant leak out the back of the motor first to determine where it is coming from, but if it does turn out to be a head gasket, I'll have to pull the injectors at the very least so while they are out...... Might as well rebuild em. And I'm thinking why put in rebuilt injectors on a pump that's 50 yrs old and likely never been rebuilt? I just knew you happened to have injectors and pump that had already been rebuilt and wondered if there might have been a tag or box indicating who had done the work.

We have a trip to Colorado planned this July so it needs to be in tip top shape for that... 1,000 miles in a week of mostly dirt towing a trailer kind of took its toll on everything.... But what a trip!

 

jeepermc, my mechanic had my water pump rebuilt by a shop in Florence, Az. It is working well. I do want them to rebuild my engine since there has never been any work done on it. The compression is low and it is smoking really bad. They are not having any luck finding a rebuild kit or other parts for the Perkins. Do you have information as to where they may find parts to rebuild the engine?

 

Did you end up using the kit I linked for you to rebuild the water pump? I'd like to confirm that works. I don't recall what if the bore is different or the stroke between the 4.192 and 4.203. If you haven't downloaded these manuals, I suggest you do. I learned more about the 4.192 in the first couple pages of reading than I was able to garner from any internet search previously.

http://jeepwillysworld.com/blog/2015/10/23/workshop-manual-perkins-diesel-engine-4-192-203-1961/

 

Its the bore. Same stroke.

4.192 is 3.5" bore and 5" stroke
4.203 is 3.6" bore and 5" stroke

As for a rebuild kit- You could likely use a 4.203 kit and change the sleeves out to the slightly larger bore but I don't know this for certain. You may want to contact Olav again at Sheffield tractor and see if he has any leads on a rebuild kit for the 4.192 specifically. I can't find a compression spec off the top of my head, but I'd figure out what it's supposed to be and compare before I condemned the engine to a rebuild. It could even be as simple as a valve adjustment potentially, or injection pump needing work, or injectors.

 

Compression ratio for 4.192 = 16.5:1

 

Hey boys Blast From the Past! I know some yall may remember Pete's Thread. I sold him a Perkins Diesel engine for a Cj5 & he started on it, some the newer folks may not have never seen this. Since this thread kinda ended abruptly I thought I would give an update! I spoke with Pete tonight he is doing good. As far as the Jeep went he got a new job, a new wife, a cross the state move & as result of this Trama we call Life he was forced to un-a$$ from some stuff & unfortunatley the Jeep was on the list...But the good news is Pete said the new owner has the little Perkins running! And even better Pete has a new Jeep he is working on in the Builds forum! As I find out more about the old Perkins I'll report back. Just thought yall like to know!