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Another Lathe Thread...

Discussion in 'The Tool Shed' started by 73 cj5, Feb 15, 2021.

  1. Feb 15, 2021
    73 cj5

    73 cj5 Not ready for the junkyard yet

    Clinton, Mississippi
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    I've been looking for an affordable (cheap) lathe to modify a distributor and other things. My issue is I don't know what these are worth and I certainly don't want to overpay or buy a complete pile of junk.

    Here are a few that I've been looking at. I'm most interested in this south bend. Lathe
    Metal lathe
    Lathe

    This looks more like a novelty item.
    Metal lathe
     
    piffey263 likes this.
  2. Feb 15, 2021
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    South bend is the go-to. You need it to be long enough and with enough swing to do what you need.
    Threading is a must. Quick change gears are nice.
     
    73 cj5 likes this.
  3. Feb 15, 2021
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    The top lathe is a South Bend, has quite a bit of stuff, can't really tell the condition, its a 3-1/2' bed. Thread dial there, nice taper attachment, drill chuck and such. Not worth $2300 to me but if you can get it for $1800-$1900 that would be good. You would have to see it run!!!! Number 2 and 4 are both Atlas lathes and are not worth much in my opinion, mainly because there is to much missing or not included to make them worth even $500. Number 3 looks ok but not sure what brand it is, maybe a Simplex or such. Its definitely not a major player in the game so parts if needed would be hard to find or have to be made.
     
    73 cj5 likes this.
  4. Feb 15, 2021
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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  5. Feb 15, 2021
    73 cj5

    73 cj5 Not ready for the junkyard yet

    Clinton, Mississippi
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    Thanks for the links @Mcruff. I like the 9x36 Southbend and Logan lathe.
     
  6. Feb 26, 2021
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I've been looking at lathes and mills off and on. Finally broke down and ordered one from Precision Matthews. I simply couldn't find a decent Southbend around here - at least one I would trust for the money they wanted.

    It should be here sometime in March... Now to find a place in the shop to put it :susp:
     
    dozerjim and 47v6 like this.
  7. Feb 26, 2021
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    USA
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    Which one did you get?
    At 6 grand, this one https://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/pm-1440e-lb/ really catches my eye. It doesn't state if it comes with a chuck or not. Taiwan manufacture and brand a couple different ways, but this is the cheapest site as I can see.

    For 6 grand, it doesn't make economic sense to pay 3K for a worn out machine or really more than 1500 IMO.

    As far as Taiwan goes, My bridgeport clone is one made in 1979, beat to a pulp. I paid around 700 bucks for it and it makes me money. I would go Taiwan over Chinese any day...
     
    Stakebed and Jw60 like this.
  8. Feb 26, 2021
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    A good machinist might not be happy but can use a junk lathe to make something. A good machine is nothing with a junk machinist.
     
    dozerjim and Mcruff like this.
  9. Feb 26, 2021
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    The complete truth right there!!
     
  10. Feb 26, 2021
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    The equipment listed it comes with:

    • 2 Axis DRO, Installed
    • Wedge Type quick change tool post set with 5 holders, BXA Size
    • 2″ Spindle Bore!
    • Heavy Cast Iron Base!
    • 8″ 3 Jaw Chuck
    • 8″ 4 Jaw Chuck
    • Face Plate
    • Steady Rest
    • Follow Rest
    • Coolant System
    • L.E.D. Work Light
    • Inch and Metric Threading Capability
    • Thread Chasing Dial
    • Foot Brake
    • Splash Guard
    • 3 year Warranty
    This thing weighs 1800lbs, may I ask why you need a lathe that big? Personally I like the PM12"x 36"for about $4000.
    At a certain point a lathe really is 2 big, if you want to make smaller parts up to a mid sized part a smaller lathe is better. After a certain size making small parts gets to be harder or damn near impossible. For home use a 14x40 you posted is the outer limit for sure and it will be hard to make small parts under say 1/2" to 3/4" in diameter.
     
  11. Feb 26, 2021
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I got the PM-1022V with DRO. Figured IF I need anything too complex - I'll ping McRuff :D

    It's been years since I did any machine work - did it when I was working in a welding/machine shop at the end of HS and before going into the Army. I'm just looking to start back with the basics, and maybe get a basic mill. Too many things I want to do that just take more manual work than I'm willing to do in my old age...
     
    Stakebed likes this.
  12. Feb 27, 2021
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

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    I didn't click the plus sign and just went with the abridged version of included components. The PM12X36 is what would replace what I have now but with a shorter distance between centers. Right now I have about 40" between centers and maybe a bit more. This is not an asset. With lengths more than 12" from the headstock, I need a steady rest or a live center at a minimum and honestly my ways are not perfectly straight so my tolerances get out of whack.

    What I have now is a Clausing from 1959 to about 1965. Clausing 12-inch Model 6300 lathe Its variable speed via a reeves style drive and has a 3 phase motor. It does not include a clutch or a brake. I replaced the reeves belt a while back when it blew, replaced both.. To rewire this lathe I would install a VFD and program in dynamic braking and an emergency stop. I paid about 1K for this lathe and all tooling on C/L almost a decade ago.

    I fabricated a new cross feed screw and reduced my backlash to .003. Dials work correctly and accurately, so I really don't need DRO. I can install an indicator on the apron for depth, should I need it.

    My headstock is L00 and its old and difficult to find accessories. All of them are worn out as mine. My Bernard scrolling chuck is bout worthless, So if I can't fit stock in my Chinese collet chuck, I use the huge 4 jaw independent and indicate it in. The Chinese collet chuck was super cheap at under 200 bucks and came with a cast iron L00 adapter that needed machined to work, which I did. Depending on what collet I use, I can get about +/- .001-.0005. I'm very happy with that.

    I agree that the 14" throw is at the upper end of what I can really use, but I would rather have a bit more capability than less. The higher rigidity of a BXA tool post would be nice with associated beefier apron. Arguably, this larger throw could limit my smaller work, but I am not seriously in the market to replace what I have now. It does what I need until it doesn't. At that point I repair, as usual or buy new because at these price points, used is money wasted.

    Any one of these https://www.precisionmatthews.com/product-category/lathes/12-14-swing/ 12, 13 or 14" lathes look to be an excellent value and upon a second cursory look, that 13" is pretty nice with runout specs well under my machinist capabilities.

    When I look at these sub 6K machines, I cannot for the life of me justify spending more than 1K on any used lathe. They don't have the beauty of a Monarch 10EE Monarch EE Series | Monarch Lathes but they are also a small fraction of price.

    Another question begins, as business and personal capabilities grow, when is the transition from hobby to professionally machined parts and components? When a certain number of years or a class certificate to frame on a 70's brown paneled wall or having machinist buddies, or when gross sales for these parts reach a threshold? And what is that threshold? 5K, 50k a week, month, year? When time is money and time spent on old junk cost more than the junk machines, at a certain point the old machines actually hold a person or business back and inhibit growth, spinning your wheels fixing that junk.

    I understand this thread is more hobby centered, but those hobby activities can grow into something very valuable. Look at the stuff Brennan has made and what he can offer.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2021
  13. Feb 27, 2021
    Howard Eisenhauer

    Howard Eisenhauer Administrator Staff Member

    Tantallon, Nova...
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    True diss:gaah:

    The funny part is it's the spur of the moment "pop up" stuff, not the planned projects, that make me thankful I got my mill & lathe.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  14. Feb 27, 2021
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    Same applies with the 3d printer. Making adapters for child gates.... it's just easier to justify a $200 that uses $20 of material and worst case gives you a burnt finger.

    I can certainly use a lathe and mill but not in a household environment. Way too easy for a kid to think they know what they are doing and loose an arm.
     
  15. Feb 27, 2021
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Mill is next. Probably will get a bit more basic level of mill than I did the lathe... Keep closer to my original budget - and I can do that with the drill press I have too.
     
  16. Feb 27, 2021
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    That’s easy enough to fix, put power disconnect boxes on each machine and lock them out with the only key on your car key chain.
     
  17. Mar 17, 2021
    teletech

    teletech Member

    Santa Cruz, CA
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    I see 10EEs around here, $6k for a good runner and $1500 for a project. Once you use one, you will never feel comfortable standing in front of a cheap import lathe.
    We have a big "Super Precision" lathe at work and all of us dread using it, only if it won't fit on the Hardinge, Monarch, or P&W, will we step up to it. The accuracy is fine and it's quiet and true, it just isn't built the same and we all feel it.
    That said, there are plenty of Clausing, Pratt&Whitney, and other fine old american-made lathes that can be had for cheap and will serve you for your lifetime with distinction and style.
    A regular South-Bend or Logan will suffice for basic work if you are pressed for space.
    It's like owning a jeep, sure, it will need service and tinkering but a Hundai just has no soul. Similarly, a classic Jeep will cost a lot less than a new car, particularly for what you get.
    CL for local sale is great, check for machinery auctions in your area, and at a *last* resort consider a machinery-broker. Check with whatever machinery-movers/riggers work your area as they often know where things are to be found.
     
  18. Jan 22, 2023
    73 cj5

    73 cj5 Not ready for the junkyard yet

    Clinton, Mississippi
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  19. Jan 22, 2023
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    That is a LeBlond regal from about 1920 or so. LeBlond’s are great machines but that thing is way to old and to big for most uses. A LeBlond from the early 40’s thru today in say 13”-14” swing would be a good lathe, that one not so much. I love antique machines but that ones to old even for me.
     
    73 cj5 likes this.
  20. Jan 22, 2023
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

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    Nope. That's a 9' bed and serious weight. 3 phase and I don't see any tooling.
     
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