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Saginaw Power Steering (pics) Please Add Yours!

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Mcruff, Aug 5, 2005.

  1. Sep 20, 2009
    ElbeHills

    ElbeHills New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2009
    Messages:
    11
    I think mine came from a 80's or so pickup. Not certain though. I got it at a yard for around 70 bucks with two keys. It pretty much bolted right in.
     
  2. Sep 25, 2009
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Messages:
    4,460
    My saggy is a bit different in that it is one from a 73 vette and is basically a manual box with a long pitman shaft/housing that put the steering shaft above the frame rail while allowing the pitman to pass below. The frame horn was boxed with 3/16 and the a 1/2" mounting plate was welded in to bolt sector to. Power is via a GM control valve on the end of the drag link and a separate hydraulic assist cylinder. I am using a Sweet pump with a Speedway bracket for this setup. My 3B album has some jpgs for some of this.
     
  3. Nov 1, 2009
    powerwagon

    powerwagon New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2009
    Messages:
    9
    any one post pics on there steering column swap? year models to snag one from? I am doing a powerw stering swap on my 66 cj-5. I am going to use a 86 cherokee steering gear along with the lower shaft.could i une the 86 cherokee column/or is a chebe column eseyer?
     
  4. Nov 6, 2009
    Jokenring

    Jokenring Member

    Wetside of...
    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2006
    Messages:
    83
    I snagged one out of an '80s Cherokee. It is a GM coulumn they are all roughly the same from that era, they length of the column is a little different (inch or two plus or minus in length). The Cherokee is pretty short and good to use. I cut the floor mount of the column off and took all of the bracketry off. I also cut off the mounts for the ignition setup (I am using the stock CJ stuff there). I left the high beam switch dohicky on because I will be moving the high beams up to the column.

    The dash plate hole will have to be enlarged to fit the new column, no problem with a plasma and a cylinder grinding stone. I also used a 2-1/2" exhaust clamp to hold the bottom of the steering column to the mount at the fire wall. Once everything is set and mocked in place, weld the dash plate to the column.

    For the steering shaft to the box I found parts at Flaming River. The column end is a DD joint (two DD ends) a 36" DD shaft and another joint that is DD to 3/4" 36 spline for the box. Just for the shaft and joints it is around 230 bucks or so. I haven't bought those yet, because I want a slip shaft, and am still looking for something that might work. Need about a 36" shaft including joints. Anybody have any ideas on that?

    Keep in mind this is on a '74 not sure if the column mounts are the same for your '66.
     
  5. Nov 6, 2009
    mtndewmaniac66

    mtndewmaniac66 Down to Earth!

    Vernal, Utah.
    Joined:
    May 25, 2006
    Messages:
    178
    I used a 1983 AMC Eagle as a donor vehicle for my power steering swap. I have discovered that the power steering gear is essentially the same one used on the 80's Cherokee XJ, as well as several cars, trucks and SUV's. (I have the cross reference saved for future reference). I have also discovered that the Cherokee XJ and the AMC Eagle used parts that are the same, or very similar, to those found in the 76 and up CJ's. The only difference that I have found thus far is the steering gears that are NOT of the CJ have a quicker ratio. The Eagle box takes three and a half turns from lock to lock.

    I have some work to finish on my swap, but I am at the point where I can turn my wheels with the weight of the jeep on the ground. I tightened down the links just last night, I will have to do a tape measure alignment and to center the steering wheel. I still have the column/firewall mount to fab up. In the meantime I have a temporary plate fabbed up to support the lower end of the column. Plus, I will have to fab up a power steering pump bracket for the 134F, I am looking forward to that challenge. (yeah, riiight)!



    Anyway, this is what I have thus far. Here is the bracket I had made to adapt the GM column.
    [​IMG]

    The column mounted to the bracket.
    [​IMG]

    Here is the fabbed steering gear bracket with the frame mounting plate. The plate is of 1/4" steel, while the bracket is a beefy 1/2". I welded grade 8 nuts to small plates to aid in installation.
    [​IMG]

    Here is a better shot of the steering gear bracket.
    [​IMG]

    Here is the front view of the steering gear and bracket assembly.
    [​IMG]

    The top view of the steering gear and plate/bracket assembly.
    [​IMG]

    Here is the bottom right side view, the drag link and tie rod assembly are almost in perfect alignment, and the pitman arm is level.
    [​IMG]

    The bottom front view of the steering box attachment.
    [​IMG]

    The upper end of the steering shaft on the column.
    [​IMG]

    The lower end of the steering shaft mounted to the box. I had to notch some of the frame cross member out in order to get the clearances and alignment that I needed.
    [​IMG]
    That hole that is drilled through the cross member was intended for the steering shaft, but due to my steering box reset, it will serve as a means to pass the power steering hoses through.

    I will hopefully have more work done within the next month or so. My progress is slow but sure. If I see something that doesn't work, or I deem unsafe, I will start over until I find a way that is safe and secure. I am happy with what I have thus far.
     
  6. Nov 8, 2009
    bobracing

    bobracing web wheeler

    Richland, WA
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2007
    Messages:
    215
    Nice, almost like the factory.
    only thing you might consider is putting a bend on the front and back of the cross support (plate). Plate isn't very strong (think bending & twisting) but adding bends will strength it substantially. If you really like fancy, use hole flares on the clearance holes, this will add more strength but also that extra "bling".
     
    tymbom likes this.
  7. Nov 9, 2009
    mtndewmaniac66

    mtndewmaniac66 Down to Earth!

    Vernal, Utah.
    Joined:
    May 25, 2006
    Messages:
    178
    Thanks bob. I wanted something functional that didn't look like a butched job.

    I did consider the bend in the plate, you probably noticed the bolt holes are offset more to the rear of the plate, this was for the bend once I seen how everything was going to line up. I figured that the frame rails were less likely to twist next to the cross member. I just might fab up another plate using my specs from the old one. I don't have a bender, otherwise this would have been done already. I am also going to make a steering box brace that will tie into the right frame rail.

    So little time, so much to do.R)
     
  8. Nov 16, 2009
    NoFlyZone

    NoFlyZone Member

    Ridgeville, SC
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2006
    Messages:
    578
    Would I need to remove the winch plate in order to use McRuff's parts for the power saginaw? It is welded on to the frame at this point. My bumper is bolted on is easily removed though.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2009
  9. Nov 20, 2009
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Messages:
    4,460
    This is how I mounted the Saginaw Vette box in the 3B.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2009
  10. Nov 20, 2009
    SKT

    SKT I Like CJ's...

    Location
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2006
    Messages:
    641
    Subscribed to this thread...thanks to all sharing info and pics!
     
  11. Dec 9, 2009
    thirtycal

    thirtycal New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2009
    Messages:
    2
    Can I modify the late CJ5 tie rod and drag link to work on a CJ2A? I don't want to pay for an expensive tie rod kit when I can get a new tie rod with new ends for about $40
     
  12. Dec 11, 2009
    mtndewmaniac66

    mtndewmaniac66 Down to Earth!

    Vernal, Utah.
    Joined:
    May 25, 2006
    Messages:
    178
    My Jeep is a '65 CJ5A. I am not sure of the differences in dimensions from knuckle to knuckle from a CJ2A to that of a CJ5A, but when I performed my power steering conversion, I took down my measurements and went online to Krage, 4WD.com, and Quadratec. I ordered the following parts from 4wd.com beacuse of the better pricing. I still had to trim almost an inch off of the parts to make them fit, but they were acceptable. Here are the parts that I used.

    Tie Rod Tube, Knuckle To Knuckle, 40-1/2"
    Part#: 5350589 (18050.01)
    Model: CJ5
    Year: 72-83

    Drag Link Assy, Pitman Arm To RH Knuckle, 28-1/8"
    Part#: 5356105, (18054.01)
    Model: CJ5
    Year: 72-83

    I ordered the parts for the narrow track axle. They all worked perfectly once I was all done.
     
  13. Dec 12, 2009
    thirtycal

    thirtycal New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2009
    Messages:
    2
    which tie rod end did you use on the passenger side to connect the draglink to the tie rod?
     
  14. Dec 12, 2009
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
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    Someone on here will probably tell me I am full of beans or worse, but I think all the "double" Jeep tie rod ends are the same-the one originally used at the bell crank and also used for the one piece tie rod conversion. Depending on what springs you are using, sometimes there is a clearence issue using these on the passenger side for this conversion-something to watch. I too made my tie rod by shortening an intermediate CJ5 rod. For mine, I chucked it up in the lathe and extended the threads in the right hand thread end to the desired depth then cut it off and milled the slot a corresponding amount. I think these are 11/16-18 threads and taps are readily available from ENCO or MSC. If you can find a double hole right side knuckle-used in wagons, pickups and early J trucks, it makes a cleaner installation and eliminates the spring clearence issue, with the drag link running all the way to the knuckle as shown below. All of the 25, 27, and 44 closed knuckles are interchangable. I use the older GM control valve style power steering so my draglink was made from a forged GM piece, but you could also use a modified tie rod with a normal saggy box. A lot of older vehicles used the 11/16-18 threads, including older Ramblers, so with a little scrounging you can probably find pieces that need little modification. The draglink tie rod end shown below was for a 60 Rambler wagon.


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  15. Dec 12, 2009
    NoFlyZone

    NoFlyZone Member

    Ridgeville, SC
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2006
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    578
    Has anybody thought of making a highsteer arm like the mb's had?
     
  16. Dec 12, 2009
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
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    Not sure I want four 3/8" cap screws holding a high steer arm on. The MB/GPW setup is pretty wimpy-way more so than the cast, intregal steering arms.
     
  17. Dec 14, 2009
    mtndewmaniac66

    mtndewmaniac66 Down to Earth!

    Vernal, Utah.
    Joined:
    May 25, 2006
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    178
    I used what had came in the parts kit box. Like duffer, I used a dbl. hole steering knuckle. I salvaged a '63 wagoneer rolling frame and used parts from it. I did not use a thread tap at the time, but i had just enough clearances to make the set up work. But I may explore this option at a later date.
     
  18. Jan 18, 2010
    dvw86

    dvw86 Member

    Eastern Washington
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2007
    Messages:
    191
    Well mine isn't a power setup but it is a Saqinaw conversion. I chose to go with a seven turn manual box. It is off of a mid 1980's Oldsmobile. I wish I could say what year or model it was, but I got it off of Ebay and don't really remember. I was specifically looking for a seven turn lock-to-lock Saginaw box. It came with the dropped pitman arm as well. This makes it fairly easy to turn the wheel without the extras of a power steering pump and hoses. Also if your engine decides to stall out you don't have a sudden loss of steering as well. The downside is that there are only three mounting bolts instead of four. As long as you don't plan on using really big tires this shouldn't be a problem. (You shouldn't turn your wheels when not moving anyways) The brackets were home made from thick steel plate. Steel pipe was used to make spacers so the frame wouldn't get crushed from tightening the mounting bolts. New original style tie rods were used. The bellcrank tie rod with the hole went to the passenger side wheel. I had a bit of a hard time finding the correct tie rod for the pitman arm. The guys at the local AutoZone were very patient in helping me and brought boxes of tierods from the back until we found the right one. The trouble was that the Olds tie rod was metric, so I machined an adapter "spud" with metric threads on one end and the Jeep threads on the other. I drilled a hole through the front cross member for the steering rod to pass through. I will weld in a pipe sleeve to reinforce the cross member before it's finished. The brackets are bolted on and tack welded, but they will get fully welded once everything is in place. I'm not done yet but here it is so far.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  19. Jan 27, 2010
    alex211

    alex211 Member

    Pennsylvania
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2009
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    441
    Has anyone done this using fenderwell headers with a V6?
     
  20. Jan 28, 2010
    dvw86

    dvw86 Member

    Eastern Washington
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2007
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    191
    Mine will be receiving a V6 with fenderwell headers, but they are not in yet.
     
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