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Please explain easy welding : MIG or Inverter

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Alan28, Jul 12, 2014.

  1. Jul 12, 2014
    Alan28

    Alan28 Well-Known Member 2022 Sponsor

    Châtillon en...
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    Consider that I am french, it means a sub-human not fluent in english.

    So I have a old big electric welding machine bought in 1989.
    My friends tell me that is is easy now to weld steel.

    The new welding machines are with "inverter" and it is easier apparently to make welding.
    The helmets use a LCD to see before and during, the old system was more difficult; price of such an apparatus : minimum 300$

    But there is also a MIG with a small gas tank for argon. it is more expensive, around 900$ small one, but is is easier.

    What I have to weld is : some small parts on my Jeep to go to perfection.
    metalware for my house, stairs, lamps and furniture to repair, garden tools, and others.
    For copper I have a gas welder (water pipes for ex).

    But this is not everyday, so this MIG should be miraculous if for instance I can create myself furniture, car pieces, Jeep seat, etc...

    Thanks for advice.
     
  2. Jul 12, 2014
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    OK I'll take a shot at this:................So I assume you have an old ARC welder that burns a coated rod.........The coating on the rod is the flux that creates a clean weld zone while the welding is taking place via melting / burning off the primary wire , that is used to fill or attache steel to steel.

    And inverter is normally a high frequency switching unit that is either built in to many machines or can be added to an older power supply much like perhaps the "ARC" Welder you now have.............This process is known as TIG or Tungsten inert Gas welding that requires gas shielding and hand fed filler rod. This same machine can either act as an ARC welder or a TIG welder.

    The MIG Process is much like and ARC welder except the welding wire is fed continuously via a roll attached to the machine.........That wire can either be bare and shielded via a Gas mixture of either Argon or a CO-2 mix of both. Flux core wire can also be used eliminating the need for shielding gas. This method is more of a Production method but can be still used on small projects.

    None of the Process's are easy to Master...........all require practice and a understanding of each process and the type of materials you are welding along with the filler metals that are being used.

    Your old ARC welder can do all of the jobs that you require............as long as your machine is stable electrically and can operate at lower settings that may be needed on thin material...........Arc welding rod is available in many type's and wire thickness's

    In my shop I have all 4 Process's here: Gas acetylene , TIG , ARC and MIG and they all have a specific purpose..............but if I was only going to own one it would be the simple ARC welder as it can cover just about all the bases with proper understanding and practice.........
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2014
  3. Jul 12, 2014
    supertrooper

    supertrooper Member

    moreno valley, ca
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    You should look into a used mig welder go save a little money. Fluxcore is another option, its a combination of mig and arc welding. The welding machine works like mig welder but the wire has flux in it and no argon is needed. Most fluxcore welders can be converted to mig. Arc welding is difficult if welding sheet metal and leaves lot of slag and splatter.
     
  4. Jul 12, 2014
    GeoffreyL

    GeoffreyL Well-Known Member

    moorestown, nj
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    Mig is much easier for thinner metal, Arc welding is better for thicker metals. i have both but i use the mig most of the time and only the arc for vehicle frames and such. I found mig easier to learn and do well than Arc, but i also started with mig.
     
  5. Jul 12, 2014
    djcj3a

    djcj3a Member

    Ukiah, CA
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    I have an Eastwood 175 MIG, and have been really happy with it for the price. I have run straight co2 and 75/25 through it, both with great results. For the price, you can't go wrong, and they will ship internationally. It also looks like it will work with the 230V 50hz power I believe is used in france:

    http://www.eastwood.com/mig-welders-175-amp-mig-welder-w-spool-gun.html

    I completely agree with Tarry, as an all around machine, stick is the way to go. But MIG is cleaner, and in my opinion easier. If you're looking into a hobbyist welder, mig is the way to go.
     
  6. Jul 12, 2014
    Twin2

    Twin2 not him 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Virginia Beach, VA
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    This is my input on this
    ARC - AC/DC welding will do most structural steel welding jobs 1/8" and thicker metals
    MIG - with proper wire and gasses will do steel / aluminum . 20ga and thicker /also will do fluxcore welding wire for production welding / outside work steel
    TIG - with proper tungsten and gasses . will make the cleanness welds . steel / stainless steel / aluminum . useful when doing small parts .thin pipe or panels
    started welding in shipyard 1977
    one note about home MIG welding units . 110 volt units are fine for welding sheet metal . but to really do thicker metals I would go with a 220 volt MIG welder more power and longer duty cycle for welding
     
  7. Jul 13, 2014
    Alan28

    Alan28 Well-Known Member 2022 Sponsor

    Châtillon en...
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    For info, this is my "old" welding stuff. It works on 220v but it is a bit powerful for my electric line because when I use it, sometimes the electricity breaks, I must restart.
    And it is quite strong when I touch the metal with the electrod it sticks or I have some problems to control!crickett
    This is why I don't use it. Also I don't see well in the helmet but there are new with LCD so it seems easier to see through and make contact better.

    A friend told me that with the new welding+inverter there is no problem, and then I read that the MIG is affordable. So I read your infos because you are all experts.

    Welding is not my job but I can weld more because it is useful and I have a house with barns, machines, etc... so I can use welding more.

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Jul 13, 2014
    Mike S

    Mike S Sponsor

    Cameron Park Ca.
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    First off, get a good helmet--------the newer electronic ones with the auto darkening are great units.

    It may turn out that with a good helmet and some practice, you will find out the old welder will serve your needs.

    If you do choose to go with a new welder, MIG is much easier than TIG. MIG is basically "point and shoot" and you can learn it pretty quickly. TIG is commonly used to weld stainless or aluminum as well as more common steel. TIG is like gas welding where you hold the heat source in one hand, and you feed in the filler rod with the other hand------and you have a foot control to adjust the arc. The heat form TIG is electric instead of gas.

    Your old unit looks to be rather heavy duty, more of a commercial unit than a home unit.
     
  9. Jul 13, 2014
    Alan28

    Alan28 Well-Known Member 2022 Sponsor

    Châtillon en...
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    Maybe the good idea is to buy one of these new helmets, seems very useful, then if I see I can weld better than before.
    This welding unit was a pro. Small pro.
    I'll visit this shop, I know them well and they give me welding lessons... They sell all for garden, but are also a pro big metalwork shop, so the boss is OK to explain me all. He was explaining me the subject of the gas for MIG, there is a contract, etc... or I use small bottles (cylinders) of argon or similar.
    I am not in a hurry, I'll take time to learn. And I listen to you, the Jeep specialists...
     
  10. Jul 13, 2014
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    It might help to understand better what the majority of your welding may be?.........If it is machines , farm equipment and such then I still believe the arch welder is best suited, from the standpoint that it will weld from 1/16" to 1/2" plate. Rusted or dirty metal and welding outdoors is what the arc welder does best...........I would still suggest that you get some different sized electrodes like the ones in the picture ( these range from 3/32" to 5/32" with the 3/32" rod I can weld 1/16" sheet metal all day with low amperage) and experiment on some scrap metal with the various sized rods at different heat ranges on your machine.............as far as seeing what your doing you need to first take your current welding helmet apart and see what shade lens ( there rated by color & numbered) usually from 9-13 with 13 being the darkest. The norm is usually a 10-11 shade..........It would also help just to wash and clean your lens including the protective outside throwaway lens...........electronic hats only give you the option of changing shades quickly & some do have a larger viewing area as compared to the standard 2"x4.5 " sized lens.

    Your incoming power / service should be looked at..........It could be a plug , could be the distance away your welding machine is set up from the main service entrance. It could be the wire size that does not have the capacity to carry the amperage to the welder and a host of other issues. A smaller welding machine be it an ARC or MIG will run on 110v but it is only able to weld up to perhaps 3/16" metal under the best conditions.

    And Yes a MIG wire feed is affordable , probably $600-$1200 but it does not do well on dirty rusted material without first cleaning it more so than needed to weld with the ARC.

    Again the only way you will get better at welding is to first experiment & practice....................then make some decisions as to what you really need.

    DIFFERENT SIZED ARC WELDING ROD TO WELD DIFFERENT THICKNESS'S OF MATERIAL.
    [​IMG]

    THIS MILLER 211 MIG IS A DUAL VOLTAGE WIRE MACHINE.......IT WILL RUN ON EITHER 110V OR 220V........OF COURSE THE LOWER VOLTAGE LIMITS YOU TO THINNER MATERIAL WHILE THE HIGHER VOLTAGE ALLOWS WELDING UP TO 3/8" PLATE THIS IS THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS IN A WIRE FEED. VERY STABLE IN ALL RANGES.
    [​IMG]
     
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