Wont Start when Hot

[noah]

I have a 69 Commando with the 225 that has a problem when it is warmed up. It runs fine, but after driving for 20min-30min, I turn it off and it wont start until it cools down. This is keeping me from using it more. Because if I stall in trafic, I cant get it started. It can be push started when this happens, so I am pretty sure the problem is electrical. The starter, alternator, ballast resistor, distributor, battery, coil, plugs, wires, and ground and positive lines from the battery are all new. I would like to get this resolved so my wife and I can use it this summer. Any and all help is appreciated. I just started it for the first time this year yesterday. It sounds good and I'm itching to go.

Thanks,

John cushman

[Pack Rat]

When you say it won't start do you mean it turns over but doesn't fire or it doesn't turn over at all?

[firegod33]

Same question. Does it not turn over or does it turn over but not start?
If it won't turn over, the starter is probably getting overheated by the exhaust. The only solutions would be to
1) Move the exhaust further away from the starter.
2) Place a heat shield between the starter and exhaust.
3) Replace the starter with a Mean Green starter.

If it turns over but won't start, you may have a vapor lock problem. In that case, the fuel is getting too hot in the line and vaporizing. The pump is designed to pump liquid. Take a look at your fuel lines. If they are close to anything hot, try rerouting them away from the heat source. I've also known people to wrap their lines with aluminum foil, shiny side out.
One friend of mine even rigged a second windshield washer pump and resevoir to spray on the fuel pump in a Bronco that he had put a 460 in.

[mainejeepster]

Hi Noah,
If your jeepster won't turn over (or sound like it's trying to start), but instead just goes "click", then you've probably got a problem with your starter.
This is very common. GM starters (like that on your Buick designed 225) have the starting solenoid built into the starter. JC whittney and many other auto parts stores sell starter solenoid relocation units that move the solenoid to a new location away from the heat of the exhaust.
I'm sure a MeanGreen starter would do the trick, but those things are wicked expensive. If you want the information on the starter relocation kit, just respond on this post. I'll dig out the info that I have from when I did the same thing.
Take care, Nathan

[noah]

I had a new exhaust installed at a local muffler shop. I dont remember having the problem before that, but I didnt drive it much then either. The only other thing I did was to put an ignition activated solenoid in between the alternator and the battery because of some drain on the battery. I hear a click, but i am not sure if it is the alternator isolation solonoid or the starter. I would like to know about the starter solonoid relocation kit. I just need to get this thing more reliable.

Thanks,

John

[sparky]

I think Mainejeepster is right, I'm guessing that the solenoid is getting too hot.

A relocation kit would be likely to do the trick for ya.

[Pack Rat]

You mean this one? (http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Product/Pr-p_Product.CATENTRY_ID:2005176/c-10101/Nty-1/p-2005176/Ntx-mode+matchallpartial/N-10101/tf-Browse/s-10101/Ntk-AllTextSearchGroup?Ntt=solenid+relocation) No way that's going to help a Delco with this style solenoid. Forgot to mention, since you've replaced everything pretty much, grounds, grounds and grounds. Body to frame, frame to engine, battery to body, battery to engine.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h286/packrat_2006/starter_1.jpg

[mainejeepster]

Follow Pack Rats link to the JCWhittney part. That's the part I used and it fixed mine no problem! Pack Rat, why do you say it won't work?

[Pack Rat]

If your starter has this type solenoid already mounted on the starter then yes, relocating it will help.
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h286/packrat_2006/th_DelcoSolenoid.gif (http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h286/packrat_2006/DelcoSolenoid.gif)
If it's this type all you're doing is adding another solenoid. Does nothing to prevent the solenoid that actually engages the starter from overheating.
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h286/packrat_2006/th_DelcoStarter.jpg (http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h286/packrat_2006/DelcoStarter.jpg)
If you have the starter in the second picture I guess my question would be why would adding another solenoid prevent the one on the starter from over heating?

[sparky]

You mean this one? (http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Product/Pr-p_Product.CATENTRY_ID:2005176/c-10101/Nty-1/p-2005176/Ntx-mode+matchallpartial/N-10101/tf-Browse/s-10101/Ntk-AllTextSearchGroup?Ntt=solenid+relocation) No way that's going to help a Delco with this style solenoid. Forgot to mention, since you've replaced everything pretty much, grounds, grounds and grounds. Body to frame, frame to engine, battery to body, battery to engine.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h286/packrat_2006/starter_1.jpg

Doh! You're right. That's probably what it is.

Relocation won't work. :oops: I forgot the style that was used on these engines.

Thanks Pack Rat.

[Pack Rat]

They also used the Prestolite which did have the solenoid mounted on the starter or the inner fender. The Delco is the more common starter used and is usually the replacement of choice to get rid of the Prestoilte.

[noah]

I remade my whole wiring harness and installed braided grounding straps with new lugs and clean hardware when I rebuilt the whole thing. My headders run right next to the starter though. I think you guys are right about the started being overheated. I origionally had a Prestalite started and switched it with an Autozone starter. The autozone piece of junk could be bad, but I had an origional in it and it did the same thing. I think I am going to try a heat shield and see what happens. I might try the gardenhose trick just to verify that it is the problem. Does that sound like a good plan of attack? I hate fixing something until the source of the problem is definate.

[Pack Rat]

AH HA! Headers! Yes, know all about that. Two hours in a rest area between Knoxville and Asheville,NC in my 86 Dodge :roll: . Heat shield and a quality starter. Might want to try some header wrap too.

[firegod33]

'71 Chevelle. Installed headers and started replacing starters every three months. Beware of header wrap. It retains moisture and will rust out your headers. Try the garden hose test. If it proves to be an overheated starter (I think it will), slap a heat shield in there. It may not stop the problem, but it should help.

[Randyzzz]

Here's a couple of links to the hot-start kits...


http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/148_0312_chevrolet_no_start_fix/


http://www.doityourself.com/stry/qnatrucks2